Owen, I agree that your suggestions are perfectly reasonable. Now, just as an academic exercise ( ;-] ), how about if you try presenting your views to a few of Sarah Palin's hundreds of thousands of avid Tea Partiers. Pick a random sample. Be prepared to dodge flecks of flying spittle. And to hear about Death Squads.
--Doug On Sun, Feb 14, 2010 at 9:26 AM, Owen Densmore <[email protected]> wrote: > I don't buy the health care debate being quite so one sided. Certainly > there is self interest in the insurance world, but there is equal opposing > interest. > > Businesses both large and small realize health care in other countries is > subsidizing their competition. Thus Detroit was first in line to lobby for > health care. > > Doctors too are lobbying against the absurd malpractice litigation which > has become a barrier to practice. > > There are a few steps that could be made that would get little resistance > from the corporate devils you paint. For example, why not require people to > pay for a reasonable insurance plan? We are required to do so for car > insurance. Our current practice drives folks to use the emergency room for > their doctor at a huge and silly additional cost. > > So: 1) Require universal health care insurance. But 2) Remove > preconditions. See the yin/yang? Insurance companies have already said > that pair would work for them, as have the AMA/doctors. And yes, 3) > Subsidize those who cannot afford the base rate. And 4) limit malpractice > litigation. It is claimed that just these 4 steps would reduce the cost of > current health care and increase businesses competitiveness significantly. > And properly put in place the right market counter forces to the evil > corporations. > > We ourselves need to change. How many of us spend as much on medical care > as we do our cars? In my calculations, cars and their care still cost more. > Compare auto leasing costs for two cars for the standard family and > insurance for same and they're surprisingly close. Add upkeep of the car > and they are way ahead. > > -- Owen > > > On Feb 14, 2010, at 9:04 AM, Douglas Roberts wrote: > > Pamela, > > I think the healthcare issue goes way beyond just the usual corporate > profit protection, pay for play political game. Look at how polarized the > nation has become over just this issue alone. Look at how many people * > don't* believe that the healthcare issue is really about healthcare > insurance industry profit protection. > > We truly are a nation of idiots. We deserve Rush Limbaugh, Sarah Palin, > and Pat Robertson. > > Model that, if you like. The agents in the individual based simulation > won't need much sophistication. > > --Doug > > On Sun, Feb 14, 2010 at 8:00 AM, Pamela McCorduck <[email protected]> wrote: > >> When Kennedy envisioned going to the moon, no lobby existed to fight >> ferociously for the sole right to take the profits from going to the moon, >> and the sole right to decide who gets to go. >> >> If you read the not-very-deep subtext in this fight, you will see that >> it's not about giving better healthcare to Americans (which we desperately >> need) but about protecting the enormous profits of the healthcare insurance >> industry. It's dressed up in "right to choose," and "privacy between doctor >> and patient," and "keep the government out of medical care," but it's really >> about profit protection. From several different and reliable sources (one of >> them a congressional candidate) I have heard that since early last summer, >> the insurance and pharmaceuticals industries have been spending over $1 >> million per day on lobbying. It continues. You can do the arithmetic. >> >> The media regularly reports on how much better, cheaper, and more >> effective medical plans are all around the developed world. It doesn't >> penetrate $1 million-plus per day. >> >> >> >> On Feb 13, 2010, at 3:55 PM, Jochen Fromm wrote: >> >> Where does all this whining about health care >>> come from? Everyone in Germany has a health >>> insurance, it is obligatory. There is general >>> agreement here that the European (and esp. >>> the German) health care system is better >>> and more social than the one in the US. >>> The USA obviously needs a better health care >>> system. Where is the American optimism and >>> the "i believe we can do it" spirit? I've heard >>> that optimism and positive thinking is a typical >>> American attitude. >>> >>> America is lacking a vision, something like >>> Kennedy's vision to bring a man to the moon >>> and back. Military and NASA won't do it >>> this time. A vision or a common dream which >>> would foster technological innovation. Schmidt >>> mentioned "renewable energy" and green >>> technology. What about a clean L.A. with >>> fresh air? A large scale scientific initiative >>> to create the first AI would be another one. >>> America would have the resources to do it, it >>> has the companies with the largest data centers. >>> It should be proud of Google, Microsoft, >>> Amazon, and Apple. It is difficult to understand >>> why it disputes about health care so long. >>> >>> -J. >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: Roger Critchlow >>> To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group >>> Sent: Saturday, February 13, 2010 6:54 PM >>> Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Sources of Innovation >>> >>> [...] We're too busy defending ourselves from hedge fund vampires and >>> health care ghouls to worry about growth. Say what you will about the >>> undead, they steal their profits fair and square and invest them in the rule >>> of law. >>> >>>
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