On 2021-04-07 23:27, aventa...@fastmail.fm wrote:
I think folks have different definitions of what an operating system should
be.
Agreed.
An Operating System (OS) is an interface between a computer user and
computer
hardware. An operating system is a software which performs all the basic
tasks
like file management, memory management, process management, handling input
and
output, and controlling peripheral devices such as disk drives and printers.
If you add or take away from the above definition, then there is your
misunderstanding.
IMHO many refer to Linux as an Operating System. When in fact it is a Kernel.
Which
is also what you describe above.
OTOH, UNIX as an OS has a defined set of commands available, as well as
servers to
facilitate running a fully installed server. Which is what I believe he was
referring to.
At this point I think this thread is becoming tiresome. ;-)
--Chris
Best Regards,
Vic Thacker
On Wed, Apr 7, 2021, at 21:17, tech-lists wrote:
Hi, I'm a bit late to the discussion
On Mon, Apr 05, 2021 at 07:44:59AM -0700, Cy Schubert wrote:
>I think this is an excellent start. My shopping list includes:
>
>- remove ftp(1)
>- remove ftpd(8)
>- remove telnet(1)
>- remove telnetd(8)
>- remove ftp:// and http:// from libfetch. This is 2021 and we should all
>use https://.
>- replace DNS lookups with DoH and/or DoT. Why let your ISP see your DNS
>traffic?
Very firmly against this, and this sort of thing, for the following
reasons:
1. I want an OS, not a kernel. If I just want a kernel, then why not go
with linux? FreeBSD is meant to be, I think, (generally), a server OS.
So, would you agree that it needs the ability to have server protocols
easily configured, with a minimum of fuss, without packages?
2. a lot of infrastructure depends on ftpd. it's easy to configure
securely ftpd in base.
3. there are some networks, like internal ones, where encryption is not
a requirement, or appropriate.
4. there are some places where encryption is in fact illegal.
>Personally, I'd suggest we remove the ftpd server *AND* ftp client and rely
>on ports. Having worked on UNIX, Internet security, and firewalls over the
>last 3/5 of my almost 50 year career, I have lamented the existence of the
>FTP protocol back in 1995 and I hate the FTP protocol with greater a
>passion today. Let's simply remove all vestiges of FTP from the base
>system, including libfetch, sooner than later. We don't need it now that we
>have HTTPS and POST; and sftp.
5. some services commonly don't use https. Lots of internet radio
stations don't. If https is enforced then the user will have to jump
through more hoops than they already do in order to, in this case,
listen to internet radio. Or face a loss of functionality.
6. not everywhere will have constant internet access. Not everyone will
want to use pkgs or have space for the ports tree.
>I think we should make it our goal to remove any and all unencrypted
>protocols from FreeBSD by 2025.
I think you should carefully think of the consequences of removing
functionality in the default install. It will make it less useful, not
more.
--
J.
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