On Thu, 2018-10-04 at 11:58 -0600, Warner Losh wrote: > On Thu, Oct 4, 2018 at 11:47 AM Ian Lepore <i...@freebsd.org> wrote: > > > > > On Thu, 2018-10-04 at 11:38 -0600, Warner Losh wrote: > > > > > > On Thu, Oct 4, 2018 at 11:26 AM Ian Lepore <i...@freebsd.org> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, 2018-10-04 at 10:21 -0600, Warner Losh wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Oct 4, 2018 at 10:15 AM Michelle Sullivan > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > tech-lists wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm astonished you're considering removing rl given how > > > > > > > common > > it is. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'll second that comment - though no disrespect to > > > > > > Brooks. Brooks > > as > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > far as I can see is just the messenger. > > > > > > > > > > > Absent good data, one has to make one's best guesses. I > > > > > guessed wrong > > > > here > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in my comments to Brooks about which ones were must keeps. I > > > > > knew it > > was > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > popular back in the day (~2000), but had thought it's > > > > > popularity had > > > > waned > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > much more than it apparently has. I last deployed systems > > > > > with rl in > > them > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > around 2007, and at the time it was trailing edge gear (the > > > > > SBCs we > > used > > > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Timing Solutions tended to use popular, but ~5-year-old > > > > > technology > > > > because > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > that market segment wanted longevity of spare > > > > > availability...). > > > > > > > > > > Warner > > > > 11 years later, we (Timing Solutions, now a division of > > > > Microchip) are > > > > still using SBCs with rl(4) hardware and still shipping > > > > software > > > > updates with that driver built into the kernel. We build > > > > systems with a > > > > lifespan in the field of 20 years or more, and the stability > > > > and > > > > compatibility across OS upgrades over that kind of span is a > > > > BIG reason > > > > to use freebsd rather than linux for such things. > > > > > > > OK. I'd have thought those SBCs would have gone out of production > > > years > > > ago.... It's a good datapoint to know that there's multiple users > > > of > > > FreeBSD using these parts in products that are still shipping. > > > That's a > > > clear and compelling benefit to the project that offsets the > > > efforts that > > > it's taken them to keep things current with rl. > > > > > > In this case, though, rl is off the list, so that hardware should > > > still > > be > > > > > > good. The only other SBC I was aware of at Timing Solutions was > > > one that > > > had an 'ed' chip on it (an ISA realtek part IIRC) that was used > > > in around > > > 2001, but in a 'one off' custom setup that I don't think will > > > ever be > > > upgraded.... But I have to ask since I know how things worked > > > during my > > > time there and systems that 'would never be upgraded' often times > > > were > > > later... > > > > > > I'd also suggest that rl stands in stark contrast to the cs, wb, > > > sn, smc, > > > sf, tl, tx and vr drivers, which nobody has mentioned in this > > > thread, and > > > which I doubt are in use in any FreeBSD system of any age today. > > > > > > Warner > > I checked all our various kernel configs, and the only one on the > > list > > we still use appears to be rl. > > > > One driver I was surprised to see was not on the list was vte. So > > I'll > > just preemptively mention that we do use that one too. > > > I'll assume that you've deployed more than 5 of these systems and > that you > may someday upgrade them as well? Which of the Vortex86 processors > are you > using, if you can answer that... > > Warner
It's a DM&P Vortex86DX on a PCA-6743 board, which you can still buy. 32-bit only, BTW, which is why I hate hearing recent mumblings about discarding 32-bit x86 support in freebsd. -- Ian _______________________________________________ freebsd-net@freebsd.org mailing list https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-net To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-net-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"
