While I support the idea that we should have a discussion about how to manage and structure our bureaucratic elements, I think the distinction posited between American and European perspectives is imaginary. As an example, personally I have so far declined to accept "bureaucrat" status largely because of the connotations of the name. This despite the fact that I feel reasonably capable of navigating most bureaucracies (a skill that has far more to do with whether someone can "appreciate" bureaucracy than their nationality).
--Michael Snow On 9/25/2010 8:53 AM, Milos Rancic wrote: > If I understood well, Americans don't have such bad feelings toward > the word "bureaucracy" and its derivatives. In Europe it is different. > When I tell to Gerard that he is better bureaucrat than me, he feels > offended; although I thought about specific virtues, not defects; and > although I've defined myself a number of times as a Wikimedia > bureaucrat. > > That difference lays probably in 300 years of different developments > of societies. Franz Kafka wasn't living in 18th century, but in 20th. > Horrors of bureaucracies wasn't so obvious in 18th century because it > is hard to say that any kind of sensible bureaucracy existed then. > Arbitrariness of feudatories and rulers was much bigger problem. And > at least in the case of bureaucracy, Americans had much more luck. > > As you could see I am usually use the "American" meaning of the word > "bureaucracy" and its derivatives. Complex societies can't exist > without more or less good bureaucracies. Unlike many of my friends, I > appreciate good formal bureaucracy. This is the minimum and it is much > better to deal with formal bureaucracy than with informal relations. > As a user of [social] institutions you can count on formal > bureaucracy, while it is not possible with informal relations. > > However, to be effective, bureaucracy has to be managed. This is > particularly true for very complex bureaucracies, and Wikimedia is > already a very complex bureaucracy. And it (bureaucracy) is not > managed well. > > The main problem with not well managed bureaucracies are not well > defined responsibilities. In other words, it is not possible to say > that one person or one group is responsible for some malfunctioning. > It is the product of the right decisions at the lower level of > complexity, which creates malfunctioning at the higher level of > complexity. > > That means that I am not blaming anyone particularly, but that we have > increasing number of the problems of that type; which means that all > of us have to think how not to make such mistakes. > > Last couple of months I am not uploading images to Commons as I would > like to do. Not counting that I block all of my upload link for ten or > more minutes per one high resolution photo, it is very painful process > even for 20k logo. > > Today I am working from my netbook. It is not so easy to find the > right button and the screen is small. I wanted to upload 20k logo for > new Wikipedia edition (in Banjar) [1]. I wanted to find the right > copyright tag (logo is trademark of WMF). So, I clicked on > "Permissions" link, instead on question mark. When I went back all of > the form was blanked. > > Note that I did that because I didn't want to be arrogant bureaucrat. > People who want that project have already created SVG logo and I > didn't want to insist that they have to create PNG derivative; I can > do that, it should be easier. > > So, I wanted to do that as I treat that as my responsibility. I filled > the form once again and I had to spend next ~15 minutes while trying > to upload the 20k logo: license is not correct, author is not correct, > this is not correct, that is not correct. And I am using Commons from > the time when it started to exist. > > There is no way that I would be willing to upload any file on Commons > because I would like to do it; just if I have to do it. > > The logical question is, of course, have I complained about it? This > problem exists for a year or so. And I am sure that I am not the only > person who complained about it in various ways. > > The first step in solving the problem is to ask one of the responsible > persons to fix it. So, maybe a year ago, I've asked that person. He > told me to fill the bug. No, I am not willing to fill the bug. (Note > that I am doing that regularly as a LangCom member.) > > There are three types of [technical] bugs in process: (1) mostly, > nothing has been done; (2) my bug is redundant, someone is working [or > not] on this issue already (in this case for a year or so); (3) if I > am lucky and someone responds to the initial bug request, I would have > to spend hours in defining, explaining etc. > > And I just wanted to upload a photo or logo. It should last for 5-15 > minutes, depending on my upload speed. Not hours in explaining what > the problem is. > > And if I have to spend hours every time when I see a problem, I think > that it is much more reasonable to spend hours in talking about the > problem in general. > > This particular problem has and doesn't have responsible persons or > groups. The problem lays somewhere between Commons community and WMF > tech staff. And the point is that any of those groups could make our > life easier, while I suppose that all of them think that it is not > their problem, but the problem for which another group is responsible. > > Both of the groups made right decisions at the lower level of > complexity. The first one wanted to be sure that there are a lot of > explanations, the second has put upload form with more useful > features. However, the final product is a nightmare from the point of > the basic usability: you can't upload file effectively, which is the > main purpose of the upload form (and Commons). > > I am sure that there are a lot of similar problems all over Wikimedia > projects. Something has to be done generally. And once again, I don't > know who should do that. Who should lead the synchronization process > between various Wikimedia groups? Or, who should delegate that problem > to a particular person or group? > > [1] - > http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Lambang_Wikipidia_Bahasa_Banjar.png > > _______________________________________________ > foundation-l mailing list > foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l > _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing list foundation-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
