-----Original Message-----
From: Denis Havlik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Bob Puff@NLE <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: Expert list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Install &
hardware discussions <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Sunday, July 09, 2000 1:21 AM
Subject: Re: [expert] MaximumLinux Magazine CD version of 7.1
>On Sat, 8 Jul 2000, Bob Puff@NLE wrote:
>
>:~>> No. Our beta-testing period for 7.1 was 3-4 x longer
than for 7.0, and
>:~>> there was nothing even near to "abrupt cesation" of
testing. There were 3
>:~>> public betas, and we did not receive any "critical bug
reports" for the
>:~>> third one, so we had all the reason to beleive that 7.1
will be a good
>:~>> product (and it is).
>:~>> but none are really "show stoppers" (workarounds exist),
and I still think
>:~>> that overal quality of 7.1 is miles better than 7.0, or
any previous
>:~>> Mandrake release:
>:~>
>:~>Well, as someone who had a little experience with 6.1, and
recently did several installs of 7.1 (never tried 7.0), I
would beg to differ with you big time. There are some
significant bugs dealing mostly with the install that I have
posted here, but no one has responded. And yes, they will
keep 7.1 from installing! Let me see if I can recall these:
>:~>
>:~>1. The CDROM bug: once you get to where it wants disk #2,
the cdrom drive will not eject a disk. No way whatsoever to
change disks. (I did manage to change the disk by powering
down the CDROM drive, but then Linux wouldn't recognize it.
Happened with two out of four computers.
>
>CDROM is supposed to auto eject. It did so on every PC i
tried, and on
>every PC we had in the company. I admitt that this is
unpleasant, but 1-st
>CD is enough for basic install, and you can always add
packages later.
>
>:~>2. The way to start the install program from a DOS prompt
is broken - doesn't work at all.
>
>Umpf? Does here, AFAIK. Anyone else has this problem?
>
>:~>3. The install program starts up running in high
resolution, if it sees you have a card that can do it.
Unfortunately, it doesn't ask if your monitor can support it,
and thus my screen turned to hash, and I was unable to install
the program. (Thankfully I had a multisync monitor on another
system that I robbed long enough to do the install.) THis
should default to 640x480, and ask / let you try higher rez if
you want.
>
>RTFD: Press F1 in the beginning of the install for help, will
you?
>
>http://www.linux-mandrake.com/en/demos/Demo/Mandrake7.1/Insta
ll/pages/install1.php3
>
>If I recall it correctly, option is called "vgalow"
>
>:~>4. Setup properly detected my 3com 509 network card, then
set up the wrong drivers for it! (Had to change from whatever
it had to the 3com 509 driver, what a concept.)
>
>Send the output of lspcidrake, and we'll fix this. This is
really weird.
>
>:~>5. Setup did not install the 75dpi or 100dpi fonts, which
gave me all sorts of error messages when X tried to start.
>
>This is strange. I installed this distro "more than once",
and NEVER got
>any problems with fonts. What have you done to our poor
installer prog?
>
>:~>6. My monitor type and card must have been screwed up
somewhere in the detection, as I couldn't even get 256 colors
at 640x480 working on one system. When I tried running the
XF86setup, it core dumps when you tell it to list devices.
>
>Would it help to tell us: "my monitor (type XY, specs
such-and-such) and
>VGA-card (type ZX, output of lspcidrake)"... Yup, it would.
>
>:~>7. "Automatic setup" is definitely not what anyone should
use.
>>It skips many important steps. Also installs junk packages,
and doesn't
>>install ones that should be installed by default (IMHO).
>
>Automatic setup has only one big minus: It does not configure
>networking. Other than that, it is quite nice for what it is
supposed to
>do: install a cute desktop for unexperienced users. In next
version
>(7.2?), this install type will install networking, and it
will also ask
>people how much "junk" they want installed
("minimal/best-of/everything
>except servers").
>
>We can argue about "installs junk/does not install important"
if you tell
>me what is junk, and what is important... Even better: Take a
look at
>numbers in depslist, change those you think should be changed
and send to
>me.
>
>:~>8. The KDE/X stuff looks like it was pre-configured for
1024x768 rez. WHen you're in 640x480, some things are off the
screen,
>>and other boxes are so large you can't even get to an OK or
CANCEL
>>button! Even in Win95, it defaults to the lowest common
denominator, and
>>every window is accessible.
>
>Windows also default to i386 architecture, we do not. We are
definitively
>not going to optimize the KDE for 640x480. (Is there some
simple way to
>get a different desktop if resolution is small?)
>
>:~>I think that any of these things would cause a newbie to
give up, if
>>they didn't have persistence. I am not a Win95 (or
microsoft) fan, but
>>for the average user, their setup works a whole lot better.
>From reading
>>the comments here, it seems that 7.0 didn't have some of the
big nasty
>>bugs that 7.1 has.
>
>Sorry to disapoint you, but I have a feeling that your
hardware is
>quite unique. Of all the "big nasty bugs" you numbered, only
"2" is likely
>to affect many people (we'll have to re-check this one, thx),
and
>"4" falls into "very unpleasant gaf" category (have you tried
>"harddrake" after install?), but nothing that can not be
>easily solved by our "install support" folks.
>
>cu
> Denis
>
>--
>-----------------------------------------------------
>Dr. Denis Havlik
<http://www.ap.univie.ac.at/users/havlik>
>Mandrakesoft ||| e-mail:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Quality Assurance (@ @) (private: [EMAIL PROTECTED])
>-------------------oOO--(_)--OOo---------------------
>visit our new discusion forum: http://forum.mandrakesoft.com
>
>
I can confirm a prob with 3c509.
Its presence inspired kudzu to pop up and keep trying to
reinstall all my other hardware--also it would not _proceed_
beyond a failed insmod for eth0
I yanked the card and sent it to Dave Null's locker.
I have seen a couple of people with drive doors stuck--they
also did not cancel and .... Ah well. I got tired of writing
"install from disk mandrake71-inst.iso and tell it you DO NOT
have the ext, then go back and rpm in from the ext what you
want to have after the install is done"
Legacy devices for the ISA bus won't even fit on my last three
mobos, and PnP was rightly named "plug N' Pray" by most techs
I know, IMHO, so I am not very worried about the 3c509B I just
rid myself of.
Civileme
