Hi Paul and All,
Rolling drag is always there and directly proportional to
weight . Since always there is the biggest factor in normal EV driving.
Aero is big starting around 25mph? Don't believe it try to
hold a 1 ft sq board out your car window at 25 mph.
Most cars cross aero being more from 35 to 45mph.
Thus if you want the most range for the least money light and
aero is the only way, it plain basic physics. If you want to do freeway aero is
much more important as drag goes up the cube of speed.
Nor does size have much to do with it as long as they are
light and aero for its job.
Light doesn't mean unsafe, F1 is very light and they walk
away from 200 mph crashes. Using medium composite tech can make an EV even
safer and lighter with Kevlar type fabrics, good design.
One thing I won't do is build a low EV as when i was 25 in
LA i watched a 65 Mustang drive thru a Lotus Europa . Not kidding it drove
right though the passenger side from behind leaving it about 1 ft tall.
Luckily for the driver who came out barely scratched. After that I want to be
high enough to be hit to bounce away, not run over.
Overall designed, done right a composite aero EV the size of
the Bolt would go 200 miles on just 24kwhr while being safer than a metal car
at 40% of the cost and weigh 1600 lbs.
Check out the GM UltraLite done in its EV form and medium
tech composites is 1k lbs , $15k, but GM refuses to build it.
Jerry Dycus
--------------------------------------------
On Wed, 9/14/16, paul dove via EV <[email protected]> wrote:
Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Na Researchers reveal 650mi on single-charge Tesla
'superbatteries'
To: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[email protected]>, "Electric Vehicle
Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Date: Wednesday, September 14, 2016, 6:46 PM
Yeah, I think your mixing
the two up by lumping them together as more efficient.
Aerodynamics buys you very little gain especially below 50
mph. Weight is directly related to energy consumption by the
formula I gave. I did a spread sheet and graph on my car and
weight dominated till you got over 50 to 60 mph. The problem
with reducing weight in a commercial vehicle is that
something else has to give. Safety features, comfort and
amenities, such as air and heat or seats, sound blocking
etc. vey small market if any for those cars especially since
it's still going to cost as much as a midsize sedan. No,
I still believe the gains will be seen in battery
advancement.
Sent from my
iPhone
> On Sep 14,
2016, at 11:48 AM, Lawrence Rhodes via EV <[email protected]>
wrote:
>
> Hey,
Paul,
> Aerodynamics is important. I
guess you never heard of Dave Clouds Dolphin or the project
Lee Hart & Jerry Dycus have been doing for a decade.
There is no reason to make cars from steel other than
economy of build. There is no reason not to be aerodynamic
except for styling. It's proven that a sparse but
comfortable vehicle will perform much better than a Tesla in
efficiency. Of course not in performance. That being
said I'd love to have a Tesla. But that being said if
I had a Tesla I'd use much more energy than I'd need
to go 400 miles. In a properly designed vehicle 15kw would
get you 400 miles. In a porky Tesla 85kw ...lets be
generous...300 miles. So almost 6 times the energy to go
3/4trs the distance. Seems to me light and aero is the way
to go. Don't forget it's even more efficient when
driving during daylight hours as the solar panel can extend
the range even further than 400 miles. The record set by
Stella Lux is 932 miles on one charge (over two days)wit
h assistance from the solar panel. There is
belief and then there is the math. Just do the math all
you car designers. Lawrence Rhodes
>
> From: paul dove <[email protected]>
> To: Lawrence Rhodes <[email protected]>;
Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[email protected]>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2016
3:50 AM
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Na
Researchers reveal 650mi on single-charge Tesla
'superbatteries'
>
> Hey Lawrence,
>
> Yeah I don't believe that is true.
Their may be some game by reducing weight I don't think
aerodynamics is going to play into it unless it's a
sports car. Most people purchase a car
>
For other reasons then economy. Comfort, utility, whatever
fits their lifestyle. Weight is the greatest factor in the
range of your vehicle. I have two electric vehicles and they
both follow the rule of thumb weight/10 = watts per mile.
This changes based on how you drive but that's the
average again. I believe battery technology will continue to
improve for another 10 years. I think the bigger problem is
the charging infrastructure. The cars are good enough now
and the batteries are good enough now there's just a
shortage of places to charge. They shouldn't start
charging stations at every gas station preferably fast
chargers.they need to quit giving away free energy and start
charging for the electricity so that the stations are
reliable and maintained by someone making a profit. Then
there would be no obstacle as to where you could drive your
car and that's coming I'm sure of that.
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Sep 12, 2016, at 10:10 PM,
Lawrence Rhodes via EV <[email protected]>
wrote:
>>
>>
Clearly the next frontier in electric automobile design is
not the battery but the efficiency of the vehicle. If it
is lighter and more aerodynamic this will allow the use of
smaller packs and longer range. With smaller packs the
charging time is reduced taking away the #1 problem with
electric cars. The charging time. Currently Solar Cars
from the Tesla Crusier Class at the World Solar challenge
with out solar assistance have a 400 mile range on 15kw of
batteries. Of course the vehicles weigh under 1000 pounds
have seating for four and the tires are very narrow.
I've been in Stella. It is comfortable and
practical. The next electric vehicle I build will be light
and efficient. Lawrence Rhodes.....
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