The 04-09 prius a/c compressors have no electronics in them, just the motor and compressor. There are 3 shielded orange wires coming out, one for each phase of the motor. The controller itself is somewhere on the main drive controller - i think it shares the cold plate.
The 2010 and later models have the controller built into the a/c compressor - much like the motor windings use the cool incoming refrigerant for cooling, the controller probably does as well. I've never actually seen one of these compressors, so I can only speculate what connections it has (B+, B- and canbus?). It would be interesting to try to sniff the canbus messages and see what commands are sent to the compressor, then try to get one running by itself. I felt there were more unknowns with the latest model compressor, so I went the other route and built a controller for the 04-09 prius compressor. Joe, Can you specify the electrical interface (which wire is what) on the Prius A/C compressor module? Cor van de Water Chief Scientist Proxim Wireless office +1 408 383 7626 Skype: cor_van_de_water XoIP +31 87 784 1130 private: cvandewater.info www.proxim.com This email message (including any attachments) contains confidential and proprietary information of Proxim Wireless Corporation. If you received this message in error, please delete it and notify the sender. Any unauthorized use, disclosure, distribution, or copying of any part of this message is prohibited. -----Original Message----- From: EV [mailto:[hidden email] <http:///user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=4676196&i=0>] On Behalf Of Joe via EV Sent: Friday, June 12, 2015 12:10 PM To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List Subject: Re: [EVDL] DIY EV air conditioning? 3 phase motors Just some info on the 2nd gen prius a/c compressors that I've either read about or figured out from playing with them: They're 6 pole motors, so 3 electrical cycles per one physical cycle. I've seen specs that say max speed is 6000 rpm (100 Hz), so that'd be 300 Hz output from the inverter. I did see another document that said up to 7500 rpm. With my 144v nominal pack that rests close to 150V, max speed under load on hot days is about 4000 rpm. I've read that the prius pack voltage is around 200V, so maybe the 6000 rpm max speed is correct. The motor is also highly salient - that is, it's inductance is much higher in the q-axis (if i remember right). Reluctance torque can be generated with current along the d-axis and increase the overall torque per amp. The motor can run open loop - in fact, I do this in order to ramp the motor up to a minimum speed before the sensorless position algorithm takes over. But, running open loop will limit the max speed and decrease the torque per amp and overall efficiency. On Fri, Jun 12, 2015 at 8:45 AM, Lee Hart via EV <[hidden email] <http:///user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=4676196&i=1>> wrote: > Robert Bruninga via EV wrote: > >> 3 phase 60 Hz AC synchronous motors seem to start and run just fine >> on fixed 60 Hz frequency, why does one need to ramp up and have >> precise feedback of rotor position therefore frequency and phase to >> make a DC controller? >> > > Synchronous motors are rare on fixed 60Hz AC because they are hard to > start; and draw excessive current while trying to start. > > When you try to start it, the rotor tries to *instantly* move to the > shaft angle that corresponds to the phase of the applied AC at that > instant. To jump instantly from 0 to synchronous speed would require > *infinite* torque > (0 to 60 in 0 seconds)! And that would require infinite current! Not > gonna happen. > > Of course, it can't draw infinite current; but starting current will > be very high. The torque will be correspondingly high; but is often > still not enough to jump the rotor from a dead stop up to synchronous > speed in a single cycle. The motor might lurch forward; or even > *backward* (if that happened to be the closest direction to make shaft > position and AC waveforms match). Or just sit there and vibrate, trying in vain to "catch" > one of the cars in that train of rapidly passing AC sinewaves. > > Also, once running, the synchronous motor needs to be wound so its > back EMF at synchronous RPM just happens to be the AC supply voltage. > If the supply voltage is high, the motor still runs but has a lagging > power factor. If the supply voltage is low, it has a leading power > factor. Both of these lead to increased I2R losses and thus poorer efficiency. > > Most fixed 60Hz AC synchronous motors are modified to reduce these > problem. Synchronous-hysteresis motors have no permanent magnets; but > use a "hard" magnetic rotor material that self-magnetizes once it's > running (and de-magnetizes when it stops). Synchronous-induction > motors "bury" the magnets inside a conventional induction rotor that > is used to start the motor. Or a wound-rotor synchronous motor, with > slip rings so the field can be controlled externally. > > That said... I do think there is hope for driving a true synchronous > motor with a simple square-wave DC inverter within limits. It will > mainly be hard to start, and you won't get peak efficiency. > > -- > The greatest pleasure in life is to create something that wasn't there > before. -- Roy Spence > -- > Lee Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, www.sunrise-ev.com > > _______________________________________________ > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... 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