On Wed, 17.07.13 14:36, Denys Vlasenko (dvlas...@redhat.com) wrote:

> > instead of administrators simply adding rsyslog or syslog-ng manually
> > at install time or to their ks snippets.
> 
> And this too was answered several times already.
> The machine in question may be already borked.
> Our support people will need to figure out -
> over the phone or email! - what has happened on client's
> installation, and having traditional grep/sed/awk
> recipes not working anymore because /var/log/messages
> is not there anymore is an extremely unwelcome discovery
> in an emergency.
> 
> You guys aren't administrators who are dealing with
> these problems every day. You don't feel the pain
> you create for other people.

Again:

"cat /var/log/messages" becomes "journalctl"
"tail -f /var/log/messages" becomes "journalctl -f"
"tail -n100 /var/log/messages" becomes "journalctl -n100"
"grep foobar /var/log/messages" becomes "journalctl | grep foobar"

This isn't complex. You can grep/sed/awk as much as you want. You just
do it over the output of journalctl rather than teh file. That's not
that big a difference.

And if you really need it as a file, you can do "journalctl >
/var/log/messages", and have it in a file. And if that doesn't cut it
and you want something that is "living", then install rsyslog and you
got the real /var/log/messages back.

> > and quite frankly administrators that complain about journal have not
> > actually tried it and experienced the flexibility the journactl
> > gives them it truly is not as bad as some people are trying to
> > make it out to be.
> 
> False argument. People (on this thread) aren't complaining about
> journactl being a bad thing.
> They are complaining about /var/log/messages disappearing.

It's only disappearing as a file, it is not disappearing as a text
format. "journalctl" has that, and thanks to the power of unix pipelines
you can make use of that pretty much in the sam ways in grep/sed/awk as
the text file itself.

Lennart

-- 
Lennart Poettering - Red Hat, Inc.
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