Hi all,

Several people mentioned Spark event listeners. After looking more
closely into this feature, I think it actually looks very similar to
what I'm proposing:

- The primary intended use cases that I could find are : monitoring
job progress, tracking stages and task completion, gathering metrics
[1].

- Events are distributed asynchronously via an internal component
called SparkListenerBus [2], which manages an event bus and a
single-threaded event queue.

- The API consists solely of methods that return void without checked
exceptions: IOW, the API wasn't designed to allow for listeners to
interact with the server (other than throwing an unchecked exception,
of course).

- Afaict if a listener throws, the bus catches the exception and moves on.

I'm not an expert in this topic so I might be wrong here, but the
suggestion that Spark event listeners were designed to allow listeners
to modify Spark's behavior doesn't look accurate to me.

Thanks,
Alex

[1]: 
https://www.ibm.com/think/insights/apache-spark-monitoring-using-listeners-and-data-quality-libraries
[2]: 
https://spark.apache.org/docs/latest/api/java/org/apache/spark/scheduler/SparkListenerBus.html

On Tue, Nov 11, 2025 at 1:30 PM Dmitri Bourlatchkov <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> Hi Eric,
>
> I would very much prefer not to use the event listener SPI as a means to
> control the operation of the Polaris Server.
>
> More specifically, I believe that any error / exception in an event
> listener should not affect the processing of the request.
>
> If we need custom callbacks to control some aspects of the server
> behaviour, let's define a dedicated SPI for that, but, IMHO, it should be
> outside the scope of events. WDYT?
>
> Thanks,
> Dmitri.
>
> On Mon, Nov 10, 2025 at 8:55 PM Eric Maynard <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> > In fact, shouldn’t it be exclusively a listener’s decision on whether an
> > event is handled in a blocking way or not? As was noted in a past thread on
> > events, much of the utility of the event framework comes from the ability
> > to introduce custom logic and hooks into the normal operation of Polaris.
> >
> > If you wish, for example, to prevent the creation of more than 1k tables
> > with some given prefix, you can do so using a listener. If the event which
> > might trigger that logic becomes non-blocking, you would no longer be able
> > to block/fail the create table request.
> >
> > I think maybe it’s the name “event”, but we seem to keep conflating these
> > hooks with the iceberg events or auditing events when they are not exactly
> > the same thing.
> >
> > —EM
> >
> > On Mon, Nov 10, 2025 at 8:47 PM Adnan Hemani
> > <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi Alex,
> > >
> > > Thanks for writing down the proposal for this! As I had previously
> > > suggested this when implementing the Persistence of Polaris Events
> > > <https://github.com/apache/polaris/pull/1844>, I am obviously very much
> > in
> > > favor of doing this :)
> > >
> > > A few questions I have regarding your vision of how we should implement
> > > this:
> > > * Are you envisioning anything for being able to make dependencies
> > between
> > > event listeners? Or are we taking a set direction that Event Listeners
> > > should be independent of each other?
> > > * In some listeners we have the ability to make events emission
> > synchronous
> > > [example
> > > <
> > >
> > https://github.com/apache/polaris/blob/main/runtime/service/src/main/java/org/apache/polaris/service/events/jsonEventListener/aws/cloudwatch/AwsCloudWatchEventListener.java#L186
> > > >].
> > > How do we plan to support/advise (or not...) that with the introduction
> > > of @Blocking annotations.
> > >
> > > Best,
> > > Adnan Hemani
> > >
> > > On Mon, Nov 10, 2025 at 11:29 AM Yufei Gu <[email protected]> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Thanks for the reply. It's overall a good idea to have async event
> > > > listeners so that they are not blocking each other.
> > > >
> > > > One downside of the async ones is that event order isn't deterministic.
> > > > For example, event listeners of Spark need the order to understand the
> > > > execution semantics. I think Polaris is fine with that, given the ts of
> > > > each event is generated by Polaris. The downstream can still figure out
> > > the
> > > > order.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks Pierre for sharing, I think any I/O-bound or potentially slow
> > > > listener should be annotated with @Blocking. That ensures we keep the
> > > event
> > > > loop responsive and avoid impacting REST latency.
> > > >
> > > > Yufei
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Mon, Nov 10, 2025 at 9:43 AM Alexandre Dutra <[email protected]>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Hi all,
> > > > >
> > > > > Answering the questions above:
> > > > >
> > > > > > However, we can easily make sure that we use Quarkus's SmallRye
> > Fault
> > > > > Tolerance
> > > > >
> > > > > Yes, that was my idea. It's not so much the bus itself that needs to
> > > > > be fault tolerant, but the receiving end, that is, the listeners. A
> > > > > listener can fail for a variety of reasons (e.g. remote broker
> > > > > unavailable), it would be nice to be able to backoff and retry
> > > > > automatically.
> > > > >
> > > > > > Since the Vert.x event bus runs on event-loop threads [...] could
> > > > > blocking or slow event listeners potentially stall REST requests and
> > > > impact
> > > > > latency?
> > > > >
> > > > > What Pierre said: this could indeed happen, but it's possible to
> > > > > annotate the receiving end with @Blocking, in which case, the
> > listener
> > > > > will be invoked in a separate pool.
> > > > >
> > > > > > With asynchronous event listeners, is there a guarantee of delivery
> > > to
> > > > > all listeners for a given event?
> > > > >
> > > > > If I understand the question correctly: with asynchronous delivery, a
> > > > > slow or failing listener wouldn't impact the delivery of the same
> > > > > event to other listeners.
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > Alex
> > > > >
> > > > > On Mon, Nov 10, 2025 at 10:12 AM Pierre Laporte <
> > [email protected]
> > > >
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Thanks for the proposal, Alex.  This sounds like a great
> > improvement.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > @Yufei As per Quarkus documentation, slow event listeners should be
> > > > > marked
> > > > > > with @Blocking so that they are not run on the event loop threads.
> > > > > > --
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Pierre
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Sat, Nov 8, 2025 at 2:14 AM Michael Collado <
> > > [email protected]
> > > > >
> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > With asynchronous event listeners, is there a guarantee of
> > delivery
> > > > to
> > > > > all
> > > > > > > listeners for a given event? The downside of synchronous
> > listeners
> > > is
> > > > > that
> > > > > > > everything is serial, but also if something fails, processing
> > > stops.
> > > > > This
> > > > > > > feels important for auditing purposes, though less important for
> > > > other
> > > > > > > cases.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Mike
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > On Fri, Nov 7, 2025 at 2:28 PM Yufei Gu <[email protected]>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Thanks, Alex and Adam. One concern I have is about the shared
> > > > runtime
> > > > > > > > thread pool.
> > > > > > > > Since the Vert.x event bus runs on event-loop threads that are
> > > also
> > > > > used
> > > > > > > by
> > > > > > > > Quarkus’ reactive REST endpoints, could blocking or slow event
> > > > > listeners
> > > > > > > > potentially stall REST requests and impact latency?
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Yufei
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > On Fri, Nov 7, 2025 at 11:25 AM Adam Christian <
> > > > > > > > [email protected]> wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I think that this would be a great enhancement. Thanks for
> > > > > proposing
> > > > > > > it!
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > The only concern I would have is around fault-tolerance. From
> > > > what
> > > > > I
> > > > > > > can
> > > > > > > > > tell, from the Quarkus documentation, the Quarkus event bus
> > > uses
> > > > > Vert.x
> > > > > > > > > EventBus which does not guarantee message delivery if failure
> > > of
> > > > > part
> > > > > > > of
> > > > > > > > > the event bus occurs [1]. However, we can easily make sure
> > that
> > > > we
> > > > > use
> > > > > > > > > Quarkus's SmallRye Fault Tolerance [2]. Is my rough
> > > understanding
> > > > > > > inline
> > > > > > > > > with your proposal?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Go community,
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Adam
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > [1]:
> > > > > > >
> > https://vertx.io/docs/apidocs/io/vertx/core/eventbus/EventBus.html
> > > > > > > > > [2]: https://quarkus.io/guides/smallrye-fault-tolerance
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > On Fri, Nov 7, 2025 at 11:49 AM Alexandre Dutra <
> > > > [email protected]
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Hi all,
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > I'd like to propose an enhancement to our existing events
> > > > > feature:
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > ability to support multiple listeners.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Currently, only a single listener can be active at a time,
> > > > which
> > > > > is
> > > > > > > > > > quite limiting. For example, we might need to persist
> > events
> > > > for
> > > > > > > audit
> > > > > > > > > > purposes and simultaneously send them to a message queue
> > for
> > > > > > > > > > optimization. With the current setup, this isn't easily
> > > > > achievable.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > While a composite listener could be created, it feels like
> > a
> > > > less
> > > > > > > > > > elegant solution, and the delivery would be strictly
> > serial,
> > > > > > > > > > processing one listener after another.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > My suggestion is to leverage Quarkus internal event bus
> > [1]:
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > 1) There will be one central event emitter responsible for
> > > > > publishing
> > > > > > > > > > events to the bus.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > 2) We will have zero to N listeners, each independently
> > > > watching
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > event bus for relevant events. They will be discovered by
> > > CDI.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > 3) We could apply filters to each listener, e.g. listener A
> > > > > listens
> > > > > > > > > > for event types X and Y, listener B only listens to event
> > > type
> > > > Y.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > 4) This approach would ensure fully asynchronous delivery
> > of
> > > > > events
> > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > > > > all interested listeners.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > 5) Fault-tolerance could also be easily implemented (event
> > > > > delivery
> > > > > > > > > > retries, timeouts, etc.).
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > What do you all think?
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > > > > > > Alex
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > [1]: https://quarkus.io/guides/reactive-event-bus
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >

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