This makes sense to me. Thanks for following up, Stan. On Thu, Nov 2, 2023 at 7:02 AM Stanislav Kozlovski <stanis...@confluent.io.invalid> wrote:
> Hi all, > > Given the discussion here and the lack of any pushback, I have changed the > dates of the release: > - KIP Freeze - *November 22 *(moved 4 days later) > - Feature Freeze - *December 6 *(moved 2 days earlier) > - Code Freeze - *December 20* > > If anyone has any thoughts against this proposal - please let me know! It > would be good to settle on this early. These will be the dates we're going > with > > Best, > Stanislav > > On Thu, Oct 26, 2023 at 12:15 AM Sophie Blee-Goldman < > sop...@responsive.dev> > wrote: > > > Thanks for the response and explanations -- I think the main question for > > me > > was whether we intended to permanently increase the KF -- FF gap from the > > historical 1 week to 3 weeks? Maybe this was a conscious decision and I > > just > > missed the memo, hopefully someone else can chime in here. I'm all for > > additional though. And looking around at some of the recent releases, it > > seems like we haven't been consistently following the "usual" schedule > > since > > the 2.x releases. > > > > Anyways, my main concern was making sure to leave a full 2 weeks between > > feature freeze and code freeze, so I'm generally happy with the new > > proposal. > > Although I would still prefer to have the KIP freeze fall on a Wednesday > -- > > Ismael actually brought up the same thing during the 3.5.0 release > > planning, > > so I'll just refer to his explanation for this: > > > > We typically choose a Wednesday for the various freeze dates - there are > > > often 1-2 day slips and it's better if that doesn't require people > > > working through the weekend. > > > > > > > (From this mailing list thread > > <https://lists.apache.org/thread/dv1rym2jkf0141sfsbkws8ckkzw7st5h>) > > > > Thanks for driving the release! > > Sophie > > > > On Wed, Oct 25, 2023 at 8:13 AM Stanislav Kozlovski > > <stanis...@confluent.io.invalid> wrote: > > > > > Thanks for the thorough response, Sophie. > > > > > > - Added to the "Future Release Plan" > > > > > > > 1. Why is the KIP freeze deadline on a Saturday? > > > > > > It was simply added as a starting point - around 30 days from the > > > announcement. We can move it earlier to the 15th of November, but my > > > thinking is later is better with these things - it's already aggressive > > > enough. e.g given the choice of Nov 15 vs Nov 18, I don't necessarily > > see a > > > strong reason to choose 15. > > > > > > If people feel strongly about this, to make up for this, we can eat > into > > > the KF-FF time as I'll touch upon later, and move FF a few days earlier > > to > > > land on a Wednesday. > > > > > > This reduces the time one has to get their feature complete after KF, > but > > > allows for longer time to a KIP accepted, so the KF-FF gap can be made > up > > > when developing the feature in parallel. > > > > > > > , this makes it easy for everyone to remember when the next deadline > is > > > so they can make sure to get everything in on time. I worry that > varying > > > this will catch people off guard. > > > > > > I don't see much value in optimizing the dates for ease of memory - > > besides > > > the KIP Freeze (which is the base date), there are only two more dates > to > > > remember that are on the wiki. More importantly, we have a plethora of > > > tools that can be used to set up reminders - so a contributor doesn't > > > necessarily need to remember anything if they're serious about getting > > > their feature in. > > > > > > > 3. Is there a particular reason for having the feature freeze almost > a > > > full 3 weeks from the KIP freeze? ... having 3 weeks between the KIP > and > > > feature freeze (which are > > > usually separated by just a single week)? > > > > > > I was going off the last two releases, which had *20 days* (~3 weeks) > in > > > between KF & FF. Here are their dates: > > > > > > - AK 3.5 > > > - KF: 22 March > > > - FF: 12 April > > > - (20 days after) > > > - CF: 26 April > > > - (14 days after) > > > - Release: 15 June > > > - 50 days after CF > > > - AK 3.6 > > > - KF: 26 July > > > - FF: 16 Aug > > > - (20 days after) > > > - CF: 30 Aug > > > - (14 days after) > > > - Release: 11 October > > > - 42 days after CF > > > > > > I don't know the precise reasoning for extending the time, nor what is > > the > > > most appropriate time - but having talked offline to some folks prior > to > > > this discussion, it seemed reasonable. > > > > > > Your proposal uses an aggressive 1-week gap between both, which is > quite > > > the jump from the previous 3 weeks. > > > > > > Perhaps someone with more direct experience in the recent can chime in > > > here. Both for the reasoning for the extension from 1w to 3w in the > last > > 2 > > > releases, and how they feel about reducing this range. > > > > > > > 4. On the other hand, we usually have a full two weeks from the > feature > > > freeze deadline to the code freeze but with the given schedule there > > would > > > only be a week and a half. Given how important this period is for > testing > > > and stabilizing the release, and how vital this is for uncovering > > blockers > > > that would have delayed the release deadline, I really think we should > > > maintain the two-week gap (at a minimum) > > > > > > This is a fair point. At the end of the day, we have to take time out > of > > > either one of the 3 ranges (now - KF; KF-FF; FF-CF;) > > > *It sounds fair to me to take out half a week from KF-FF and add it to > > > FF-CF*. e.g: > > > - KF=Nov 18 (Sat) > > > - FF=Dec 6 (Wed) 2.5w after > > > - CF=Dec 20 (Wed) 2w after > > > > > > How do others feel about this? > > > > > > > Just to throw a suggestion out there, if we want to avoid running > into > > > the winter holidays while still making up for slipping of recent > > releases, > > > what about something like this: ... > > > > > > Looking at the last 2 releases, they both had a full month between KIP > > > Freeze and Code Freeze to finish contributions. Your proposal goes back > > to > > > a more aggressive 3 weeks e2e time. All else equal, if the release date > > is > > > to be kept as early January, I would prefer to opt for the more > > > accommodative 4-week period. > > > > > > > Note that historically, we have set all the deadlines on a Wednesday > > and > > > when in doubt erred on the side of an earlier deadline ... We can, and > > > often have, allowed things to come in late between the Wednesday freeze > > > deadline and the following Friday, but only on a case-by-case basis. > > > > > > This makes sense to me. The proposal I put above puts the two critical > > > dates (FF & CF) on Wed to allow for this flexibility in case it's > needed. > > > > > > Best, > > > Stanislav > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Oct 24, 2023 at 12:40 AM Sophie Blee-Goldman < > > > sop...@responsive.dev> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Actually I have a few questions about the schedule: > > > > > > > > 1. Why is the KIP freeze deadline on a Saturday? Traditionally this > has > > > > been on a Wednesday, which is nice because it gives people until > Monday > > > to > > > > kick off the vote and give people a full 3 working days to review and > > > vote > > > > on it. Also, > > > > 2. Why are the subsequent deadlines on different days of the week? > > > Usually > > > > we aim to have the freeze deadlines separated by an integer number of > > > > weeks. Besides just being a consequence of the typical 1/2 week > > > separation > > > > between freeze dates, this makes it easy for everyone to remember > when > > > the > > > > next deadline is so they can make sure to get everything in on time. > I > > > > worry that varying this will catch people off guard. > > > > 3. Is there a particular reason for having the feature freeze almost > a > > > full > > > > 3 weeks from the KIP freeze? I understand moving the KIP freeze > > deadline > > > up > > > > to account for recent release delays, but aren't we wasting some of > > that > > > > gained time by having 3 weeks between the KIP and feature freeze > (which > > > are > > > > usually separated by just a single week)? > > > > 4. On the other hand, we usually have a full two weeks from the > feature > > > > freeze deadline to the code freeze but with the given schedule there > > > would > > > > only be a week and a half. Given how important this period is for > > testing > > > > and stabilizing the release, and how vital this is for uncovering > > > blockers > > > > that would have delayed the release deadline, I really think we > should > > > > maintain the two-week gap (at a minimum) > > > > > > > > Note that historically, we have set all the deadlines on a Wednesday > > and > > > > when in doubt erred on the side of an earlier deadline, to encourage > > > folks > > > > to get their work completed and stabilized as soon as possible. We > can, > > > and > > > > often have, allowed things to come in late between the Wednesday > freeze > > > > deadline and the following Friday, but only on a case-by-case basis. > > This > > > > way the RM has the flexibility to determine what to allow and when, > if > > > need > > > > be, while still having everyone aim for the established deadlines. > > > > > > > > Just to throw a suggestion out there, if we want to avoid running > into > > > the > > > > winter holidays while still making up for slipping of recent > releases, > > > what > > > > about something like this: > > > > > > > > KIP Freeze: Nov 22nd > > > > Feature Freeze: Nov 29th > > > > Code Freeze: Dec 13th > > > > > > > > We can keep the release target as Jan 3rd or move it up to Dec 27th. > > > > Personally, I would just aim to have it as Dec 27th but keep the > stated > > > > target as Jan 3rd, to account for unexpected blockers/delays and time > > > away > > > > during the winter holidays > > > > > > > > Thoughts? > > > > > > > > On Mon, Oct 23, 2023 at 3:14 PM Sophie Blee-Goldman < > > > sop...@responsive.dev > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Can you add the 3.7 plan to the release schedule page? > > > > > > > > > > (this --> > > > > > > > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/KAFKA/Future+release+plan) > > > > > > > > > > Thanks! > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 2:27 AM Stanislav Kozlovski > > > > > <stanis...@confluent.io.invalid> wrote: > > > > > > > > > >> Hey Chris, > > > > >> > > > > >> Thanks for the catch! It was indeed copied and I wasn't sure what > to > > > > make > > > > >> of the bullet point, so I kept it. What you say makes sense - I > > > removed > > > > >> it. > > > > >> > > > > >> I also added KIP-976! > > > > >> > > > > >> Cheers! > > > > >> > > > > >> On Sat, Oct 14, 2023 at 9:35 PM Chris Egerton < > > > fearthecel...@gmail.com> > > > > >> wrote: > > > > >> > > > > >> > Hi Stanislav, > > > > >> > > > > > >> > Thanks for putting this together! I think the "Ensure that > release > > > > >> > candidates include artifacts for the new Connect test-plugins > > > module" > > > > >> > section (which I'm guessing was copied over from the 3.6.0 > release > > > > >> plan?) > > > > >> > can be removed; we made sure that those artifacts were present > for > > > > >> 3.6.0, > > > > >> > and I don't anticipate any changes that would make them likelier > > to > > > be > > > > >> > accidentally dropped in subsequent releases than any other Maven > > > > >> artifacts > > > > >> > that we publish. > > > > >> > > > > > >> > Also, can we add KIP-976 ( > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/KAFKA/KIP-976%3A+Cluster-wide+dynamic+log+adjustment+for+Kafka+Connect > > > > >> > ) > > > > >> > to the release plan? The vote thread for it passed last week and > > > I've > > > > >> > published a complete PR ( > > https://github.com/apache/kafka/pull/14538 > > > ), > > > > >> so > > > > >> > it > > > > >> > shouldn't be too difficult to get things merged in time for > 3.7.0. > > > > >> > > > > > >> > Cheers, > > > > >> > > > > > >> > Chris > > > > >> > > > > > >> > On Sat, Oct 14, 2023 at 3:26 PM Stanislav Kozlovski > > > > >> > <stanis...@confluent.io.invalid> wrote: > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > Thanks for letting me drive it, folks. > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > I've created the 3.7.0 release page here: > > > > >> > > > > > > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/KAFKA/Release+Plan+3.7.0 > > > > >> > > It outlines the key milestones and important dates for the > > > release. > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > In particular, since the last two releases slipped their > > > originally > > > > >> > > targeted release date by taking an average of 46 days after > code > > > > >> freeze > > > > >> > (as > > > > >> > > opposed to the minimum which is 14 days), I pulled the dates > > > forward > > > > >> to > > > > >> > try > > > > >> > > and catch up with the original release schedule. > > > > >> > > You can refer to the last release during the Christmas holiday > > > > season > > > > >> - > > > > >> > > Apache > > > > >> > > Kafka 3.4 > > > > >> > > < > > > > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/KAFKA/Release+Plan+3.4.0 > > > > > > >> - > > > > >> > > to > > > > >> > > see sample dates. > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > The currently proposed dates are: > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > *KIP Freeze - 18th November *(Saturday) > > > > >> > > *This is 1 month and four days from now - rather short - but > I'm > > > > >> afraid > > > > >> > is > > > > >> > > the only lever that's easy to pull forward.* > > > > >> > > As usual, a KIP must be accepted by this date in order to be > > > > >> considered > > > > >> > for > > > > >> > > this release. Note, any KIP that may not be implemented in a > > week, > > > > or > > > > >> > that > > > > >> > > might destabilize the release, should be deferred. > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > *Feature Freeze - 8th December* (Friday) > > > > >> > > *This follows 3 weeks after the KIP Freeze, as has been the > case > > > in > > > > >> our > > > > >> > > latest releases.* > > > > >> > > By this point, we want all major features to be merged & us to > > be > > > > >> working > > > > >> > > on stabilisation. Minor features should have PRs, the release > > > branch > > > > >> > should > > > > >> > > be cut; anything not in this state will be automatically moved > > to > > > > the > > > > >> > next > > > > >> > > release in JIRA > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > *Code Freeze - 20th December* (Wednesday) > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > *Critically, this is before the holiday season and ends in the > > > > middle > > > > >> of > > > > >> > > the week, to give contributors more time and flexibility to > > > address > > > > >> any > > > > >> > > last-minute without eating into the time people usually take > > > > >> holidays. It > > > > >> > > comes 12 days after the Feature Freeze.This is two days > shorter > > > than > > > > >> the > > > > >> > > usual code freeze window. I don't have a strong opinion and am > > > open > > > > to > > > > >> > > extend it to Friday, or trade off a day/two with the KF<->FF > > date > > > > >> range.* > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > *Release -* *after January 3rd*. > > > > >> > > *It comes after a minimum of two weeks of stabilization, so > the > > > > >> earliest > > > > >> > we > > > > >> > > can start releasing is January 3rd. We will move as fast as we > > can > > > > and > > > > >> > aim > > > > >> > > completing it as early in January as possible.* > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > As for the initially-populated KIPs in the release plan, I did > > the > > > > >> > > following: > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > I kept 4 KIPs that were mentioned in 3.6, saying they would > have > > > > minor > > > > >> > > parts finished in 3.7 (as the major ones went out in 3.6) > > > > >> > > - KIP-405 Tiered Storage mentioned a major part went out with > > 3.6 > > > > and > > > > >> the > > > > >> > > remainder will come with 3.7 > > > > >> > > - KIP-890 mentioned Part 1 shipped in 3.6. I am assuming the > > > > remainder > > > > >> > will > > > > >> > > come in 3.7, and have contacted the author to confirm. > > > > >> > > - KIP-926 was partially implemented in 3.6. I am assuming the > > > > >> remainder > > > > >> > > will come in 3.7, and have contacted the author to confirm. > > > > >> > > - KIP-938 mentioned that the majority was completed and a > small > > > > >> remainder > > > > >> > > re: ForwardingManager metrics will come in 3.7. I have > contacted > > > the > > > > >> > author > > > > >> > > to confirm. > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > I then went through the JIRA filter which looks at open issues > > > with > > > > a > > > > >> Fix > > > > >> > > Version of 3.7 and added KIP-770, KIP-858, and KIP-980. > > > > >> > > I also found a fair amount of JIRAs that were targeting the > 3.7 > > > > >> release > > > > >> > but > > > > >> > > consecutively had no activity on them for the past few > releases. > > > For > > > > >> most > > > > >> > > of those, I pinged the author and explicitly asked if it's > going > > > to > > > > >> aim > > > > >> > to > > > > >> > > make it to 3.7. I have not included those here and will not > > until > > > I > > > > >> hear > > > > >> > > confirmation. > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > Please review the plan and provide any additional information > or > > > > >> updates > > > > >> > > regarding KIPs that target this release version (3.7). > > > > >> > > If you have authored any KIPs that have an inaccurate status > in > > > the > > > > >> list, > > > > >> > > or are not in the list and should be, or are in the list and > > > should > > > > >> not > > > > >> > be > > > > >> > > - please inform me in this thread so that I can keep the > > document > > > > >> > accurate > > > > >> > > and up to date. > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > Excited to get this release going! > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > All the best, > > > > >> > > Stanislav > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > On Tue, Oct 10, 2023 at 9:12 AM Bruno Cadonna < > > cado...@apache.org > > > > > > > > >> > wrote: > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > Thanks Stan! > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > +1 > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > Best, > > > > >> > > > Bruno > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > On 10/10/23 7:24 AM, Luke Chen wrote: > > > > >> > > > > Thanks Stanislav! > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > On Tue, Oct 10, 2023 at 3:05 AM Josep Prat > > > > >> > <josep.p...@aiven.io.invalid > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > wrote: > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> Thanks Stanislav! > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> ——— > > > > >> > > > >> Josep Prat > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> Aiven Deutschland GmbH > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> Alexanderufer 3-7, 10117 Berlin > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> Amtsgericht Charlottenburg, HRB 209739 B > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> Geschäftsführer: Oskari Saarenmaa & Hannu Valtonen > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> m: +491715557497 > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> w: aiven.io > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> e: josep.p...@aiven.io > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> On Mon, Oct 9, 2023, 20:05 Chris Egerton < > > > > >> fearthecel...@gmail.com> > > > > >> > > > wrote: > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >>> +1, thanks Stanislav! > > > > >> > > > >>> > > > > >> > > > >>> On Mon, Oct 9, 2023, 14:02 Bill Bejeck < > bbej...@gmail.com > > > > > > > >> wrote: > > > > >> > > > >>> > > > > >> > > > >>>> +1 > > > > >> > > > >>>> > > > > >> > > > >>>> Thanks, Stanislav! > > > > >> > > > >>>> > > > > >> > > > >>>> -Bill > > > > >> > > > >>>> > > > > >> > > > >>>> On Mon, Oct 9, 2023 at 1:59 PM Ismael Juma < > > > > m...@ismaeljuma.com> > > > > >> > > wrote: > > > > >> > > > >>>> > > > > >> > > > >>>>> Thanks for volunteering Stanislav! > > > > >> > > > >>>>> > > > > >> > > > >>>>> Ismael > > > > >> > > > >>>>> > > > > >> > > > >>>>> On Mon, Oct 9, 2023 at 10:51 AM Stanislav Kozlovski > > > > >> > > > >>>>> <stanis...@confluent.io.invalid> wrote: > > > > >> > > > >>>>> > > > > >> > > > >>>>>> Hey all! > > > > >> > > > >>>>>> > > > > >> > > > >>>>>> I would like to volunteer to be the release manager > > > driving > > > > >> the > > > > >> > > > >> next > > > > >> > > > >>>>>> release - Apache Kafka *3.7.0*. > > > > >> > > > >>>>>> > > > > >> > > > >>>>>> If there are no objections, I will start and share a > > > > release > > > > >> > plan > > > > >> > > > >>> soon > > > > >> > > > >>>>>> enough! > > > > >> > > > >>>>>> > > > > >> > > > >>>>>> Cheers, > > > > >> > > > >>>>>> Stanislav > > > > >> > > > >>>>>> > > > > >> > > > >>>>> > > > > >> > > > >>>> > > > > >> > > > >>> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > -- > > > > >> > > Best, > > > > >> > > Stanislav > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> -- > > > > >> Best, > > > > >> Stanislav > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Best, > > > Stanislav > > > > > > > > -- > Best, > Stanislav >
