> On Mar 23, 2025, at 4:38 PM, Craig Russell <apache....@gmail.com> wrote: > > > >> On Mar 20, 2025, at 07:09, Daniel Gruno <humbed...@apache.org> wrote: >> >> On 3/19/25 23:01, Chris Lambertus wrote: >>>> On Mar 19, 2025, at 1:22 PM, Daniel Gruno <humbed...@apache.org> wrote: >>>> >>>> On 3/19/25 11:28, Ruth Suehle wrote: >>>>> Those of you who have read my board report for today's meeting will have >>>>> seen that after a lengthy time of low activity, I'm pleased to appoint >>>>> Daniel Gruno to the role of VP, Diversity and Inclusion. He has been >>>>> working with Christian Grobmeier (and more recently, Melissa Logan has >>>>> joined) on plans to revive the work. I look forward to seeing their work >>>>> and encourage anyone who is interested to pitch in! >>>>> >>>>> Ruth >>>>> >>>> Thank you for that introduction (and trust), Ruth, I appreciate it. >>>> >>>> It's very early days still, but I have written up a short plan or primer >>>> for how I want to see the EDI committee working, as well as what I'd love >>>> for us to try out. You can find it here: >>>> >>>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/EDI/2025+EDI+jumpstart+plan >>> A couple initial suggestions: >>> - align the various acronyms (D&I, EDI, DEI) and be consistent. EDI seems >>> to be emerging as the preferred standard, but in the IT World of Acronyms, >>> Initialisms, and Abbreviations, the disparity between the three can be >>> quite confusing >> >> I hear you, and it's made more difficult by the tension that has been >> growing around certain variations (whether you ascribe it to mismanagement >> of initiatives or not). It gets confusing and laden with presuppositions, >> both good and bad ones. >> >> I was thinking of either sticking consistently with EDI as we have done, or >> pivot and call it IDEA (Inclusion, Diversity, Equity, and Access) and >> reframe it in a fully local foundation perspective. What do these things >> mean to us at the ASF and what do we want to accomplish, irrespective of the >> larger trends at hand. > > I was just looking at the United Nations Open Source Principles [1] which > mentions Diversity and Inclusion and specific to this discussion does not > talk about Equity. > > I think we should try to stay away from the term Equity, for a few reasons. > > It seems to be a political lightning rod that will not help our PR team > It does not seem to be universally understood > It can be seen as reverse discrimination, giving more to folks of > disadvantaged communities
I don’t think we are understanding what equity is about. Equity has a lot of definitions like for example common stock traded on various stock exchanges is called equity. You absolutely cannot talk about financial accounting without talking about equity. We have an overriding concern about vendor neutrality and I’ll ask you to explain how this is NOT also a concern about equity. We wish to treat all contributors equitably don’t we? (Truthfully I am struggling mightily to be “non-political” right now.) Best, Dave > > For these reasons the VP, Diversity and Inclusion was established > specifically excluding Equity as an objective. > > I still think we have plenty to do to foster Diversity and Inclusion here > without getting sidetracked. > > Craig > > >> Foster inclusive participation and community building: Enabling and >> facilitating diverse and inclusive contributions [1] > > > [1] The OSI First to Endorse United Nations Open Source Principles | Office > of Information and Communications Technology > unite.un.org > <favicon.ico> > > <https://unite.un.org/news/osi-first-endorse-united-nations-open-source-principles>The > OSI First to Endorse United Nations Open Source Principles | Office of > Information and Communications Technology > <https://unite.un.org/news/osi-first-endorse-united-nations-open-source-principles> > unite.un.org > <https://unite.un.org/news/osi-first-endorse-united-nations-open-source-principles> > <favicon.ico> > <https://unite.un.org/news/osi-first-endorse-united-nations-open-source-principles> >> >> >>> - add a section that describes the history, purpose, and goals of >>> EDI/DEI/D&I at the ASF. "necessity and benefits" are mentioned as >>> components, but it would be good to have an overarching goal or mission >>> statement, and metrics/goals for defining "success" or even just "movement >>> towards a goal" >> >> Agreed, but in my thinking this needs to come from the communities at the >> ASF and not just me writing a document, so I'd like to work on a >> questionnaire to send out to projects, and get a sense of what matters to >> them. >> >>> -Chris (fluxo) >>>> >>>> On April 1st, I intend to do some spring cleaning of the committee >>>> structure, essentially doing a clean slate. I truly appreciate the work >>>> that a ton of people have done in (and outside) this committee already, >>>> and will welcome anyone who wants to stay on the committee. >>>> >>>> I'd also like to invite any other members or committers of the foundation >>>> to volunteer for the committee, either by replying on this list (which is >>>> a public mailing list, FYI) or by sending me a private reply with your ASF >>>> username. >>>> >>>> This isn't paid work and you may get yelled at, but if you still want to >>>> give it a go, maybe we can keep nudging the foundation in a more >>>> equitable, accessible direction[1], and in turn benefit our users. >>>> >>>> Have a look at the jump-start plan and let me know what your thoughts are. >>>> >>>> With regards, >>>> Daniel. >>>> >>>> [1] Don't take this as a jab at our current status. We are awesome, >>>> and we can improve because we want to be...even more awesome. > > Craig L Russell > c...@apache.org >
