Hi Harmeet, The dev list is the lifeblood of an Apache project, and projects here at the ASF conduct 99% of their business in public, not in private. The ASF is a non-profit for the public good and we have a tradition of openness and transparency.
Even if the business isn’t pleasant some times, it must be discussed, in public. The committers and PMC members for the code base - the name of which is *Apache* Cassandra as the project is here at the *Apache Software Foundation* - are Apache Software Foundation committers first, when they deal or steward the Apache code-base. Even before their $dayjobs. Cheers, Chris On 6/11/16, 11:54 PM, "mylistt...@gmail.com" <mylistt...@gmail.com> wrote: >Dear All, > >I am user of Cassandra. I am grateful to each of you for providing your time >as committers to the code base for a great product. > >This is what I wanted to suggest - could you gentlemen not create a group >email Id to discuss matters of such importance amongst yourselves. Using the >dev list I am not sure is the best place. I have been reading emails where >insinuations have being made - if a particular company may high jack the code >base etc. > >We are all developers , we love our code. I don't think this is right forum to >bring things out of this proportion , read wash dirty linen. > >Pardon me if you think my opinion or inputs are wrong. > >I am newbie on Cassandra. I use it as an application developer. I don't have >any intention to judge your experiences or thoughts. Just saying this could be >done in a finer way without most if us getting to know about it. > >Regards, >Harmeet > > > >On Jun 12, 2016, at 2:31, Tom Barber <tom.bar...@meteorite.bi> wrote: > >> Looking at that thread, I'm surprised you didn't call Dave out as well, >> that attitude did no one any favours. >> >>> Because lets all face the >>> facts here, no one "likes" writing drivers and documentation, and I have >>> done both for this project. >> >> That's clearly incorrect, I (and I suspect other people) like writing docs >> because it means people can use your tools in a much easier manner than >> looking through the code or unit tests. >> >> Tooling can be a burden but it doesn't excuse not writing docs, even if it >> becomes a PMC type rule for committers to commit Docs for new features like >> they should be committing unit tests. At least it improves what is shipped >> with the Apache project in question. >> >> Tom >> >> On Sat, Jun 11, 2016 at 7:21 PM, Chris Mattmann <mattm...@apache.org> wrote: >> >>> Hi Russell, >>> >>> [CC/board@, board members may want to join the >>> Apache Cassandra lists for specifics and further >>> engagement] >>> >>> Multiple things that need to be addressed below, but TL;DR: >>> >>> 1. I have asked the Apache Cassandra PMC, and its chair, to provide >>> a detailed description on how the project *isn’t* controlled by an >>> external entity in its next monthly board report. The below further >>> re-enforces the control. Further, it re-enforces the vitriol and >>> name calling attitude when questioned and when someone suggests >>> pointing to the Apache documentation and making it better as a first >>> step. I plan on making it very loudly known at our next board meeting >>> that something is awry. CC/board@ ahead of time on that. >>> >>> 2. You don’t seem to understand Apache. This is unfortunate. I >>> went to go look you up and see if you are a PMC member for Apache >>> Cassandra. Funny enough, the main page doesn’t even link to the PMC >>> (I couldn’t find a direct link). This isn’t even correct with respect >>> to Apache branding guidelines here at the ASF. Shane, would you >>> like to comment here? For an FYI to everyone, see: >>> http://www.apache.org/foundation/marks/pmcs.html >>> >>> After a Google Search, I found this page: >>> https://wiki.apache.org/cassandra/Committers >>> >>> That looks way out of date. Luckily there is the project.apache.org >>> ASF page: https://projects.apache.org/committee.html?cassandra >>> >>> Which indicates you aren’t a committer or PMC member of the project. >>> This is unfortunate. If you wrote a book for projects I work on, I >>> would have hopefully long before and along the way got involved in >>> the community, and encouraged you to contribute to the *core effort >>> here at the ASF* and took you on the path towards becoming a PMC >>> member in the *Apache project that is the core effort*. >>> >>> In short, I can see why you don’t understand Apache. It’s likely >>> due to the fact that the Apache Cassandra PMC doesn’t seem to get >>> it either. If they did, they would have worked to explain it to >>> you. More on that later. >>> >>> 3. The fact that you think “the companies that I try to [sic] vilify >>> are the *future* of projects like this” isn’t just a statement that >>> indicates you don’t get Apache. That someone in the community (which >>> includes you even though you aren’t a committer or on the PMC) would >>> think the “companies” are the “future” of any ASF project is just >>> way way bad. Like way bad. Off the rails bad. We are *individuals* >>> here, not companies. >>> >>> 4. You state you have wrote drivers and documentation for this >>> project. Yet you aren’t a PMC member or committer at the ASF. Ever >>> scratch your head and wonder why? By itself, again, sometimes there >>> are reasons for this. Taken in context, there is something REALLY >>> wrong here. >>> >>> Now, more specific replies inline below. Jonathan and PMC members >>> for Apache Cassandra. Please take time to explain in your report >>> what’s going on. I’m hopeful with mentorship and guidance and time >>> this can be addressed but right now, not really happy with what >>> I’m seeing. >>> >>> >>> >>> ********** >>> Specific comments >>> >>> On 6/11/16, 9:48 AM, "Russell Bradberry" <rbradbe...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> I respectfully disagree. "Newbies" should be pointed in the direction >>> that >>>> will ensure the highest possibility of their success with the product. >>>> This is the best decision for the project, regardless of where the >>>> documentation may reside. >>> >>> While I agree with pointing Newbies to the point where >>> there is the best documentation - I don’t agree that place >>> should be outside of the Apache project. >>> >>>> >>>> As one of the authors of an early book on Cassandra, the reason we wrote >>> it >>>> was because the ASF documentation was abysmal. >>> >>> What did you do to try and counteract this? Did you attempt to submit >>> documentation patches and/or to submit documentation that would address >>> that? >>> >>>> Now I am happy to say that >>>> the book I wrote is obsolete, not just because it was written against an >>>> early version of Cassandra, but because the external documentation is so >>>> thorough the need for a book to be written in no longer present. >>> >>> I had no problem with your statement until you put “external” before the >>> word “documentation”. >>> >>>> >>>> If the ASF and the PMC want to promote internal documentation, then a >>>> serious amount of time and effort needs to be put into the documentation. >>>> This goes for every project in the ASF. The current state of documentation >>>> in any of the Apache projects sub-standard at best. >>> >>> This, unfortunately, is a strawman. I tell you that ASF projects should >>> have >>> the documentation that is required to run and should be the *first* place >>> you point users to for your documentation. You respond, well the ASF >>> projects >>> have crappy documentation as a whole. I totally disagree with that. Here’s >>> some examples: Tika, Nutch, Solr/Lucene, Subversion, HTTPD, Spark, Hadoop, >>> Maven, I could easily go on. >>> >>> A project that has been around as long as *Apache* (note I keep putting >>> *Apache* in front of the project name too - something I don’t see all too >>> often so far and something you should get used to) Cassandra should know >>> better. This isn’t a new Incubator project. >>> >>>> >>>> You make mention, several times, of the community, and in this case the >>>> community has decided that the best source of documentation is the one >>> that >>>> has had a company put financial investment into it. You can't expect a >>>> community of unpaid volunteers to be able to coordinate and contribute >>>> something of that high quality. >>> >>> Yes, I can. And yes, we do. That’s what we do at the ASF. It’s worked >>> for many, many years, before, Apache Cassandra. It will work long after >>> it too. >>> >>>> >>>> Full disclosure, I am *not* on the PMC, nor am I an employee of DataStax >>> or >>>> any other company that provides support for an open source project. I am a >>>> member of the community that sees the highest probability of success of >>>> this project being that the PMC supports the development of the core >>>> product while the ancillary pieces like documentation and drivers get >>>> supported by those who are paid to support it. Because lets all face the >>>> facts here, no one "likes" writing drivers and documentation, and I have >>>> done both for this project. >>> >>> Plenty of people are paid to support OSS software, even OSS software at the >>> ASF. But we must be diligent to wear our $dayjob hats, in contrast to the >>> ASF hats, and to do what’s right for the effort at Apache, since in cases >>> such as this, it is the *Apache* project, its community, and its license, >>> that are friendly to downstream users (even companies). >>> >>>> >>>> Suffice it to say, that in my opinion, these "companies" that you seem to >>>> be trying so hard to vilify are the future of projects like this. They >>> fill >>>> the gap that the ASF leaves with its volunteer based model. >>>> >>>> Also, to address your thinly veiled and pointed comments as of late. It >>>> seems you have already made up your mind about DataStax and are continuing >>>> in an effort to prove your point. Doing this in a public manner is toxic >>>> for the community and will do nothing more than to divide it and risk >>>> failure of the project. I suggest you confer with the PMC and the company >>>> *privately* to determine what is best for the project and ultimately the >>>> community. >>> >>> This statement above, sadly, indicates how broken the governance of >>> this project is. 99% of all discussion in the ASF is public. The only >>> discussion in private is that adding new PMC members and/or committers. >>> Would have been nice for someone long long long before me, to tell you >>> that. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Chris >>> >>>> >>>> Best, >>>> -Russell Bradberry >>>> >>>> On Sat, Jun 11, 2016 at 12:16 PM, Mattmann, Chris A (3980) < >>>> chris.a.mattm...@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi Everyone, >>>>> >>>>> While this may be a current great source of documentation on >>>>> Cassandra, and while it exists externally, the PMC should be >>>>> be promoting (and hopefully ensuring) that the source of documentation >>>>> for Apache Cassandra is here at the ASF. >>>>> >>>>> I’m happy to be corrected that that is the case, and/or that >>>>> I’ve missed something, but the first reply to questions like >>>>> this from newbies shouldn’t be to point to an external website. >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> Chris >>>>> >>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>> Chris Mattmann, Ph.D. >>>>> Chief Architect >>>>> Instrument Software and Science Data Systems Section (398) >>>>> NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA >>>>> Office: 168-519, Mailstop: 168-527 >>>>> Email: chris.a.mattm...@nasa.gov >>>>> WWW: http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/ >>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>> Director, Information Retrieval and Data Science Group (IRDS) >>>>> Adjunct Associate Professor, Computer Science Department >>>>> University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA >>>>> WWW: http://irds.usc.edu/ >>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 6/11/16, 8:54 AM, "Bhuvan Rawal" <bhu1ra...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi Deepak, >>>>>> >>>>>> You can try Datastax Docs, they are most extensive and updated >>>>>> documentation available. >>>>>> As Cassandra is a fast developing technology I wonder if there is a >>> Book >>>>> in >>>>>> the market which covers latest features like Materialized Views/ SASI >>>>> Index >>>>>> or new SSTable Format. I believe the best starting point would be the >>>>>> Academy Tutorials and further Planet Cassandra - A week in Cassandra >>>>> series >>>>>> provides good overview of blogs and developments by Cassandra >>> Evangelists. >>>>>> It also provides link of top blogs which help understand internal >>> working >>>>>> of the Database. >>>>>> >>>>>> However if you still feel the need, you may refer to books, here are >>> some >>>>>> that I know of - >>>>>> Beginning Apache Cassandra Development - Vivek Mishra - 2014 - Link >>>>>> < >>>>> >>> https://www.amazon.com/Beginning-Apache-Cassandra-Development-Mishra/dp/1484201434 >>>>>> >>>>>> Cassandra Data Modeling and Analysis - 2014 C.Y. Kan - Link >>>>>> < >>>>> >>> https://www.amazon.com/Cassandra-Data-Modeling-Analysis-C-Y/dp/1783988886/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1465659906&sr=1-1&keywords=cassandra+data+modeling+and+analysis >>>>>> >>>>>> Mastering Apache Cassandra - Second Edition - March 26 2015 - Link >>>>>> < >>>>> >>> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1784392618/ref=pd_lpo_sbs_dp_ss_3?pf_rd_p=1944687622&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe-1&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=1484201434&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=YVM1QBXHKAFK18J1XBAC >>>>>> >>>>>> Cassandra Design Patterns - 2015 - Link >>>>>> < >>>>> >>> https://www.amazon.com/Cassandra-Design-Patterns-Rajanarayanan-Thottuvaikkatumana/dp/178528570X/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1465659937&sr=1-1&keywords=cassandra+design+patterns >>>>>> >>>>>> Cassandra High Availability - 2014 - Link >>>>>> < >>>>> >>> https://www.amazon.com/Cassandra-High-Availability-Robbie-Strickland/dp/1783989122/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1465659975&sr=1-1&keywords=cassandra+high+availability >>>>>> >>>>>> Learning Apache Cassandra - Manage Fault Tolerant and Scalable >>> Real-Time >>>>>> Data - 2015 - Link >>>>>> < >>>>> >>> https://www.amazon.com/Learning-Apache-Cassandra-Tolerant-Real-Time/dp/1783989203/ref=sr_1_3?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1465659975&sr=1-3&keywords=cassandra+high+availability >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Best Regards, >>>>>> Bhuvan >>>>>> Datastax Certified Architect >>>>>> >>>>>> On Sat, Jun 11, 2016 at 8:28 PM, Deepak Goel <deic...@gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hey >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Namaskara~Nalama~Guten Tag~Bonjour >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I am a newbie. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Which would be the best book for a newbie to learn Cassandra? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thank You >>>>>>> Deepak >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Keigu >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Deepak >>>>>>> 73500 12833 >>>>>>> www.simtree.net, dee...@simtree.net >>>>>>> deic...@gmail.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/deicool >>>>>>> Skype: thumsupdeicool >>>>>>> Google talk: deicool >>>>>>> Blog: http://loveandfearless.wordpress.com >>>>>>> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/deicool >>>>>>> >>>>>>> "Contribute to the world, environment and more : >>>>>>> http://www.gridrepublic.org >>>>>>> " >>>>>>> >>>>> >>> >>>
