OK W. Trillich,
I'm listening. Was just away for the weekend.
Since I started the discussion about the Debian home page content I'll
try to assist you wherever and whenever I can.
Svante Signell
w trillich writes:
> from the private support i've gotten over my 'HFTFMADBUFE'
> rantings, i can tell i struck a chord: this is not specific
> to debian, it's a unix/linux-wide situation. the documentation
> is hither and yon, and the newbies don't have the knowledge
> of which tools to use in order to find what they're looking for.
>
> and this is why they ask.
>
> expert advice on this list is often the simplest way for the
> newbies to get their front-end aligned, so to speak, yet it's
> frustrating for the experts to see the same simple questions
> asked time after time.
>
> that the information exists is not enough: the lost ark was
> placed in the warehouse, but not even indiana jones would be
> able to find it--even though it's right there! you only need
> to know which box, and which aisle, to find it. for those
> who do know which box and which aisle, it gets tedious
> answering the same simple questions.
>
> so.
>
> i volunteer (and would love some assistance from
> some of you others--Svante? are you listening? hmm?)
> to spend some of my free [sic] time to make it easier
> for newbies to find their way around (so that the
> experts can focus on answering more challenging
> questions and devise more cool stuff for the rest of
> us to use in the future) by launching a two-pronged
> attack:
>
>
> 1) tinker with the debian web pages to make it more
> difficult for newbies to NOT find what they're
> looking for. examples:
> a. search field, top left number one always always always.
> if searching the whole site is kaput, then add a
> menu for choosing whether to search mailing list
> archives, packages or bugs
> b. newbie links:
> - debian faq / faq-o-matic
> - debian / linux glossary
> - where/how to download debian
> - will debian work on my hardware? [ports]
> - i386
> - powerpc
> - sparc
> etc
> - how to upgrade to a newer debian [apt-get / apt]
> - have a cgi form to generate via Q&A
> apt-get sources.list items
> - show how to determine which debian they've got
> - how to upgrade one package [apt-get]
> - manuals / documentation
> - ask other debian users [subscribe to debian-user]
> c. have the remainder of the left column contain
> - quick-start guide
> - tip of the day (maybe make a fortune database for this?)
> - debian mailing lists galore
> - why debian? [about the debian organization]
> - philosophy
> - contact
> - volunteer
> - donate
> etc.
> - languages available (use nationality flag icons)
> [need to fix "??????? ?? (GB) ?? (Big5)
> ??? ??? Dansk..." regardless]
> d. have the right column remain news-like
>
> i think it's safe to assume that the more-knowledgeable
> folk have less trouble navigating, so we can put their
> stuff further down in the hierarchy or at least further
> down on the page.
>
> online html documentation must be updated so that any reference
> to 'currently' is replaced with 'as of xx/yy/zz' to reduce
> misinformation--such as the outdated comment that "hamm (2.0) is
> the current debian release."
>
>
> 2) start on a script (perl? shell?) called, perhaps,
> "NEWBIE" that'll take any number of arguments
> and scan the local system for
> - locate <xyz>
> - apropos <xyz>
> - man <xyz>
> - info <xyz>
> - /usr/{share/,}doc/<xyz>{,-doc}/*
> - http://www.*.debian.org/doc/<xyz>
> - /var/cache/apt/*
> - dpkg -S / dpkg -L
> - iterate thru $PATH to find matching commands
> - other suggestions?
> and display command options to get the documentation
> sought, or actually run the commands themselves directly.
>
> it may require its own flat/text database of sorts, perhaps
> using an input value of english phrases describing what
> a newbie might be looking for, and an output value of
> a list of commands (or inf/man/http commands) that answer
> that request.
>
> e.g.
> "file manager" -> "mc, ..."
> "receiving/receive email" -> "fetchmail, mutt ..."
> "upgrades/upgrading" -> "apt-get, dpkg, alien..."
> "help" -> "man, info..."
>
>
>
> 2a) maybe create a TOTD to implement a tip-of-the-day,
> once per login. such as
> "looking for help sending email? try 'newbie send email'."
>
> "to update from 2.1 (slink) to 2.2 (potato), ..."
>
> "to launch XWindows, try 'startx'; to install it,
> do 'apt-get install X'"
>
> "expect to be confused now and then; it's part of the
> learning process ..."
> [not intending that to be funny--maybe if we warn them that
> not everything will fall into their laps, the newbies may
> be less inclined to think that the gurus OWE them answers.]
>
> "to configure your domain name, see 'man named' or..."
>
> "if you use XWindows, try 'apt-cache search dotfile' or..."
>
> perhaps we can find a way to distill answers from debian
> lists into such a utility. the experts are of course free
> to disable it.
>
> --
>
> what's the procedure [RTFM, here we go] for getting
> started with something like this in the debian world?
>
> comments and recruits are very welcome. newbies unite!
>
>
> --
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