On 5/14/23 12:28, Curt wrote:
On 2023-05-14, <to...@tuxteam.de> <to...@tuxteam.de> wrote:
So Redhat. But hey, look at packages.debian.org (I know, looking at
https://wiki.debian.org/NetToolsDeprecation
https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2009/03/msg00780.html
2009!!
Luk Claes and me, as the current maintainers of net-tools, we've been
thinking about it's future. Net-tools has been a core part of Debian and any
other linux based distro for many years, but it's showing its age.
It doesnt support many of the modern features of the linux kernel, the
interface is far from optimal and difficult to use in automatisation, and
also,
it hasn't got much love in the last years.
On the other side, the iproute suite, introduced around the 2.2 kernel
line, has both a much better and consistent interface, is more powerful, and
is
almost ten years old, so nobody would say it's untested.
Hence, our plans are to replace net-tools completely with iproute, maybe
leading the route for other distributions to follow. Of course, most people
and
tools use and remember the venerable old interface, so the first step would be
to write wrappers, trying to be compatible with net-tools.
At the same time, we believe that most packages using net-tools should be
patched to use iproute instead, while others can continue using the wrappers
for some time. The ifupdown package is obviously the first candidate, but it
seems that a version using iproute has been available in experimental since
2007.
All are good ideas, Curt, but the power in iproute is, maybe now s/b was
lacking, I've literally spent a frigging week trying to get iproute to
over-ride the broken 169.xx.xx.xx primary route that earlier avahi's
insisted on putting into a network config, that is why to this day the
first thing I do after an install, is find avahi and rm it and reboot.
rm because you could not remove it with apt w/o tearing down the system
far enough the only recourse was to reinstall. That is obviously an
endless loop.
I find that in bullseye, finally, avahi has developed some manners in
that it is now happy to the the 2nd route. Ditto for NM, it finally
after a decade of insisting it be done its way even when its way didn't
work, so that stuff got fixed and immediately a "sudo chattr +i" applied
so NM could not screw it up. Fortunately, NM had the good graces not to
flood the logs with "I can't screw it up" complaints.
So while we are making progress in just works networking and its not
nice to dig up old dirt, but why did it take 10 years to get those
major, show stopping problems fixed? That's what I have failed to
understand. I've been networking stuff since the middle 80's, Went from
os9 level 1 on an original coco,then level 2 on a coco3 to amigados,
running exclusively linux since 1998, I've seen kernel bugs get fixed in
an hour so why did it take a decade to fix that show stopper routing
problem? I think that is a legitimate question.
.
Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
- Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/>
