On Sun, Dec 1, 2013 at 9:26 AM, Bernhard R. Link <brl...@debian.org> wrote: > * Joel Rees <joel.r...@gmail.com> [131129 00:36]: >> The standard needs to be re-written to encourage sane behavior in >> undefined situations, and if you don't like that opinion, I'll take >> some time later, when I have some, to rip your arguments that I've >> clipped above to shreds. I don't mind if you don't. > > I think the only answer to those lines is to advise you to not use > any programs written in C.
Heh, heh, heh > I suggest writing everything in Haskell > and compiling that to java byte code run in a jvm. With the jvm > implemented in Haskell and running in an interpreter. touche (Where is the unicode palette when you want an accented e?) > Bernhard R. Link > -- > F8AC 04D5 0B9B 064B 3383 C3DA AFFC 96D1 151D FFDC I went back and started digging into the threads Mark posted way back up there, and the grad student (I think it was) at MIT is just really taking things way out of context. So is most of the thread, including my earlier reactions. The compiler writers, including the team working on LLVM/Clang, are fully aware that the appropriate behavior when a compiler optimizes based on undefined behavior is to provide for issuing warnings. Getting there is just a bigger step than they realized. I need to take the time to add to the confusion with a blog post of my own interpretation, I suppose. A lot of strange things got said, mostly by people who don't seem to be directly involved in writing the optimizing code. (No, the standard theoretically allowing bats to fly out of unpredicted places when undefined code is executed is not an optimizer's excuse to silently kill undefined behavior code. The standard does not say that, really. I'm not sure why people like to (mis)quote that misinterpretation. And there does some to be some lack of awareness that treating undefined behavior code the same as dead code is a false inversion of logic. But the guys doing the optimizations are mostly trying to avoid treating undefined behavior code that way, really.) But the point that a lot of C programmers, even experienced programmers, don't really understand the languages they are using when writing in C probably bears a bit more emphasizing. -- Joel Rees Be careful where you see conspiracy. Look first in your own heart. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-security-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/CAAr43iNm4rbvNW1F6KM1-RU1Zq+=SFzwcMcXnbbA7Xb7X8=n...@mail.gmail.com
