I concur with Russ in the strongest of terms. I, too have no idea why a blog was removed, but I think we absolutely can and should if the post crosses lines.
We, as a group of individuals working on a project together with shared resources working to maintain a constructive atmosphere must never be conflated with a Government censoring speech. We are not a Government. Please don't conflate Debian ensuring we have a healthy community with Government censorship, and conflating a blog being removed from project resources with the killing of a journalist. It cheapens the death of those who are killed by repressive regimes fighting for their freedoms. Paul On Thu, Dec 20, 2018 at 6:46 PM Russ Allbery <r...@debian.org> wrote: > > Daniel Pocock <dan...@pocock.pro> writes: > > > and I reply with the strongest possible evidence, personal experience > > and scientific research. > > You decided to distort a political issue that many of us feel strongly > about to attack a policy around what to republish in project-owned forums, > which is only on a continuum with that issue if you look for it with a > telescope. You did this in a way designed to provoke strong feelings and > create moral absolutes rather than start a conversation, and you did this > knowing full well that you were attacking a specific team inside Debian > composed, like all Debian teams, of overworked volunteer members. You did > this without the slightest attempt to extend an assumption of good will or > allow for the possibility there are further things going on that you don't > know about, and you did so with such pathetically sloppy and incomplete > research that even *I* know you are leaving out substantial background, > and I haven't been trying to follow this saga. > > In other words, you immediately turned the temperature up as high as you > could go and called on other people to attack your fellow Debian > developers on the grounds that their work is a violation of UN-recognized > human rights (!!). > > That you cannot understand how completely absurd this is means that it is > futile to try to argue this point with you on the merits. > > There *is* an underlying project debate here that is a real debate, namely > the rules for participation and republication in project forums. I think > it's a debate we've had to the point of absurdity, but I'm not horribly > surprised that people want to still have it, and if that had been all your > message had been, I would have sit on my hands and not added to the noise. > > But you saw an opportunity to artificially strengthen your debate stance > by comparing the Debian anti-harassment team to assassins (!!) and you > seem completely oblivious to why this is utterly unacceptable in > collective discussion within a project of colleagues, peers, and friends. > > I have no idea personally what set off Norbert's removal from Planet > Debian. When I said irrespective of the merits of your argument, I really > meant that. But *this* bothers me far more: this kind of brutal approach > to Debian politics is hostile, nasty, and deeply hurtful to the project. > > If you want to have a debate about the decision of a team in Debian, you > have an obligation to the project to conduct that debate with a certain > basic level of mutual respect. Asking you to not compare your fellow > project members to assassins does not seem like a high bar! If you aren't > going to do that, I for one am quite happy to make this argument about > *your* behavior, which was appalling and utterly toxic to supporting the > community of a volunteer collective project. > > > Having been rear ended by a utility van, thrown off a motorbike half way > > across a roundabout and having also received abusive and threatening > > messages from people within the Debian community, I feel that the > > physical pain caused by the latter was more than the former. Those > > people should be ashamed of themselves. > > Yeah, no shit. Your lack of awareness that *you* are that person who > should be ashamed of yourself because that's what *you* just did is > honestly mind-blowing. > > -- > Russ Allbery (r...@debian.org) <http://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/> > -- :wq
