Hi, Justin B Rye <justin.byam....@gmail.com> wrote: > Holger Wansing wrote: > > now the third patch to address more invasive things: > > > > - I have updated info on release architectures > > - I removed/changed paragraphs about floppies (still someone using them? > > :-) ) > > - I changed the description of apt (copied from official package-description > > from packages.debian.org) > > - I added a mention of UTF-8 > > > > - Should we remove docu on dselect? (outdated tool) > > That would also mean the removal of docu about dpkg-mountable. > > dpkg-mountable was a Debian package up until 2.2 "potato", but as far > as I can see this information was stale by 3.0 "woody" in 2002! > > > - Should we no longer mention the outdated repository-howto? > > - What about the modconf package/mechanism? Still required? Still existing? > > The package ceased to exist in wheezy, but I think it had been largely > redundant for a while before that.
Ok, so we can safely remove that. > > A patch as a proposal is attached. > > > > > > Review and comments are here *really* wanted! > > Comments below; meanwhile I should go and have a look at the full FAQ. > Yes, its answers badly need revising; but in principle we ought to be > doing something much more invasive, replacing Questions that are no > longer Frequently Asked. Removing some of that questions would be good indeed. > > [...] > > +++ customizing.sgml (Arbeitskopie) > > @@ -17,8 +17,8 @@ > > without compromising security? > > > > <p>Many device files in the <tt>/dev</tt> directory belong to some > > -predefined groups. For example, <tt>/dev/fd0</tt> belongs to the > > -<tt>floppy</tt> group, and <tt>/dev/dsp</tt> belongs to the > > +predefined groups. For example, <tt>/dev/sr0</tt> belongs to the > > +<tt>cdrom</tt> group, and <tt>/dev/dsp</tt> belongs to the > > <tt>audio</tt> group. Yes, /dev/dsp is not existing on my Jessie system. So we could use "/dev/sda" instead, as owned by group "disk". > I think /dev/dsp is a relic from the days before ALSA; these days it's > /dev/snd/*, and the access rights are increasingly handled via ACLs > managed by logind. That should be rephrased then, to document the new behaviour. Has someone with the relevant knowledge a small proposal for this? (I'm lacking knowledge here, sorry.) > > +++ ftparchives.sgml (Arbeitskopie) > > @@ -426,4 +426,6 @@ > > Instructions on how to do this are given in the (obsolete) <url > > name="Debian Repository > > HOWTO" > > id="http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/repository-howto/repository-howto";>. > > +# Should this link to outdated docu be removed? Or is it better, to keep > > it, > > +# since outdated docu is still better than nothing? > > It occurs to me that all this advice pre-dates the Debian Wiki. > Maybe there should be a pointer in that direction instead. Perhaps https://wiki.debian.org/HowToSetupADebianRepository would be a possible target? > > > Index: getting.sgml > > =================================================================== > > --- getting.sgml (Revision 11091) > > +++ getting.sgml (Arbeitskopie) > > @@ -51,7 +51,7 @@ > > the <url name="Debian Security Manual" > > id="http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/securing-debian-howto/";>. > > > > -<sect id="boot-floppies">Where/how can I get the Debian installation disks? > > +<sect id="boot-disks">Where/how can I get the Debian installation disks? > > The problem with "disks" is that we're now using it mostly as a > coverterm for optical media (e.g. compact discs) and SSDs (e.g. USB > thumbdrives), and neither of those are technically "disks"! > > We could say "installation media", but then there's a danger of > singular agreement problems. Maybe use "installation images"? > [...] > > <sect id="alternativebootinstaller">Are there any alternative strategies > > for booting > > the system installer? > > > > <p>Yes. Apart from CD or DVD, you can install Debian GNU/Linux by booting > > from > > -floppy disks, USB memory stick, directly from hard disk, or using TFTP net > > +USB memory stick, directly from hard disk, or using TFTP net > > booting. For installing on multiple computers it's possible to do fully > > automatic installations. NB: not all methods are supported by all computer > > architectures. Once the installer has booted, the rest of the system can > > be > > (I can personally vouch for the fact that it's still possible to do > Jessie installs off 2GB PATA hard disks and even iOmega Zip disks!) Ok, but I would value this as a corner case, so not mention in the FAQ. > > Index: kernel.sgml > [...] > > +### There is no package "modconf" in stable anymore. > > +### Is there still such mechanism in Debian, or is it no longer needed? > > + > > I don't think I'd used it since the days of ISA network cards; the > idea seems to be that it was made redundant by autodetection, and then > thrown out during the switch from module-init-tools to kmod. Ok, so drop it. > [...] > > Index: pkg_basics.sgml > > =================================================================== > [...] > > @@ -360,8 +360,7 @@ > > <em/purge/ and <em/hold/ in the package status? > > > > <p>These "want" flags tell what the user wanted to do with a package (as > > -indicated either by the user's actions in the "Select" section of > > -<tt>dselect</tt>, or by the user's direct invocations of <tt>dpkg</tt>). > > +indicated by the user's direct invocations of <tt>dpkg</tt>). > > Hmm, what "flags" is it thinking of? Should we also mention > apt/aptitude, given that marking a package for removal in aptitude's > console UI is another way of applying a persistent status? The corresponding question for this is " What is meant by <em/unknown/, <em/install/, <em/remove/, <em/purge/ and <em/hold/ in the package status?" And yes, I would add apt and aptitude additionally to dpkg here. > > <p>Their meanings are: > > <list> > > @@ -377,8 +376,7 @@ > > > > <sect id="puttingonhold">How do I put a package on hold? > > > > -<p>There are three ways of holding back packages, with dpkg, aptitude > > -or with dselect. > > +<p>There are two ways of holding back packages, with dpkg or aptitude. > > > > <p>With dpkg, you have to export the list of package selections, with: > > <example>dpkg --get-selections \* > selections.txt</example> > > Oh, and you can now also use "apt-mark (un)hold"... Good point, added. > [...] > > <sect2 id="dpkg-split">dpkg-split > > Is this utility even worth knowing about nowadays? To be honest, even > in the nineties when I was ferrying "big" (multi-MB) packages about on > floppies I found it easier to use plain "split"... Ok, so I would vote for dropping it. > [...] > > Index: uptodate.sgml > > =================================================================== > > --- uptodate.sgml (Revision 11091) > > +++ uptodate.sgml (Arbeitskopie) > > @@ -68,13 +68,13 @@ > > <p>For details, see the manual page <manref name="aptitude" section="8">, > > and the file <file>/usr/share/aptitude/README</file>. > > > > -<sect1 id="apt">apt-get, dselect and apt-cdrom > > +<sect1 id="apt">apt-get and apt-cdrom > > > > <p>An alternative to <prgn/aptitude/ is <prgn/apt-get/ which is > > APT-based command-line tool (described previously in <ref id="apt-get">). > > > > -<p>Both <prgn/apt-get/, the APT-based command-line tool for handling > > packages, and > > -<prgn/dselect/, provide a simple, safe way to install and upgrade packages. > > +<p><prgn/apt-get/, the APT-based command-line tool for handling packages, > > +provides a simple, safe way to install and upgrade packages. > > This repeats "APT-based command-line tool". Ideally we'd rewrite it > to talk about apt as the "primary" interface and things like apt-get > and aptitude as alternatives to that. Starting with Stretch, apt-get and apt-cache calls are changed and can also be called directly simply via apt: apt update apt upgrade apt full-upgrade apt remove pkg apt install pkg apt show pkg apt search str As a result, should we no longer speak of the programs apt-get or apt-cache, but always speak of apt instead? So apt would be the primary interface, and aptitude or synaptic would be alternativ ones. Holger -- ============================================================ Created with Sylpheed 3.5.0 under D E B I A N L I N U X 8 . 0 " J E S S I E " . Registered Linux User #311290 - https://linuxcounter.net/ ============================================================
