On 3/6/25 4:00 PM, Lee Garrett wrote:
On Tue, 4 Mar 2025 20:39:43 -0500, "Helmut K. C. Tessarek" <tessa...@evermeet.cx> wrote:Both network "outages" could have been prevented by adding a note at the end of the dist-upgrade output.e.g. something like the following (monospace font required for the "Attention" text):_ _____ _____ _____ _ _ _____ ___ ___ _ _ / \|_ _|_ _| ____| \ | |_ _|_ _/ _ \| \ | | / _ \ | | | | | _| | \| | | | | | | | | \| | / ___ \| | | | | |___| |\ | | | | | |_| | |\ | /_/ \_\_| |_| |_____|_| \_| |_| |___\___/|_| \_|Network interface name changed: please update config files before reboot.Why would people who do not read the NEWS.Debian or the Release Notes read that? And how would you solve the issue of people wanting more and more of those attention banners?While I agree that an *experienced* sysadmin would have caught that mistake purely by previous experience with Debian, imagine for a second an end user or fresh sysadmin.Do me a favour and go to https://www.debian.org/, and tell me how many clicks you needed to find the release notes. Now imagine you didn't know of their existence. Would you still have stumbled upon them? Do you still believe that level of sass in your response is warranted? From my experience with giving support on the Debian IRC support channel most new users are not aware the release notes exist.
It's four clicks, in 90 seconds. I'm using Debian for more than 20 years, but finding them still took considerable effort on my part. All clicks were educated guesses.
I generally get my news from apt's NEWS displays, but even though I can't be sure that my installation will be accessible after a release upgrade (I'm very sure that it'll boot, at least though).
I'm following the thread since its beginning and thinking a solution which might be useful, but I came up with basically nothing. This is one of the hard problems where computers and humans collide. Funnily, what I found useful is using Testing as a desktop system and gain the knowledge of what will gonna happen in the next release upgrade.
This creates an innate knowledge of what to do on your servers which run stable since you went through all of the changes (and then some) during the testing phase.
Greetings MarcGreets, Lee P.S.: This failure mode isn't even documented in the release notes.
Regards, H.
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