Hi Otto,

Quoting Otto Kekäläinen (2024-07-28 00:38:40)
> Hi all,
> 
> I have drafted a new DEP at
> https://salsa.debian.org/dep-team/deps/-/merge_requests/8 titled "DEP-18:
> Enable true open collaboration on all Debian packages".
> 
> Direct link to raw text:
> https://salsa.debian.org/dep-team/deps/-/raw/798bfa5a1e1609afd4e48ee20aff80a82bcd4a2f/web/deps/dep18.mdwn
> 
> This would have been a great topic to discuss in person at DebConf, but
> unfortunately I can't attend this year, so I'll just kick this off on the
> mailing list.
> 
> This is continuation to the 'single maintainership' discussions earlier
> this year. I also think that more unified and open collaboration processes
> could help decrease maintainer burnout, lower barrier for existing and new
> maintainers to help with multiple packages, and overall perhaps also
> improve quality of uploads by having more attention on the source code
> prior to upload.
> 
> If you think this proposal makes sense, please press the thumbs up button.
> 
> If you have comments, please share them here or on the draft itself.

I like how Debian discussions are email-based.  It means less work
depends on being online. I can read conversations without worrying about
tolls on network activities, and can search my private archive of
historical conversations however I want to set that up (e.g. using
notmuch).

DEP-18 mandates (or more accurately it "should-ifies") web-based
conversations. Not for bugs, specifically, but for other conversations
where I consider Debbugs and mailinglists as reasonable alternatives.
(yes, I understand that some disagree with me, and find email clumsy
and Salsa web interfaces far better).

In section 4, we "should" enable discussion and review of merge requests
as web-based Salsa conversations, which means those conversations will
not happen on mailinglists or in Debbugs. That section also says that
there is no pressure on the maintainer to engage in those conversations,
it is all about letting others contribute, but it is in the best case
confusing for contributors if their contributions are ignored, and more
likely that is perceived as quite rude behaviour of the maintainer.
To not accidentally come across as rude, I have consistently enabled
only the ability to *fork* but disabled all other more "chatty" features
because while I *do* want "true collaboration", I dislike the web-based
conversation platform offered as part of Salsa, and unfortunately Salsa
cannot be told to redirect to anywhere else, so the best I can do to
signal "I am not hanging out here, please look for me elsewhere" is to
turn those features off.

Sorry, but I disagree that the only true collaboration is Salsa-rich
collaboration. Where are my options to mirror the data at Salsa, as I
can do with mailinglists and Debbugs, to work with it also offline?

Regards,

 - Jonas

-- 
 * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
 * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/
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