On Wed, 2014-09-10 at 18:37 +0100, Ben Hutchings wrote: > On Wed, 2014-09-10 at 17:44 +0100, Noel Torres wrote: > > On Wednesday, 10 de September de 2014 03:12:16 Ben Hutchings escribió: > > > On Tue, 2014-09-09 at 21:24 +0100, Noel Torres wrote: > > > > On Tuesday, 9 de September de 2014 21:18:55 Tollef Fog Heen escribió: > > > > > ]] Carlos Alberto Lopez Perez > > > > > > > > > > > But if you don't (Is not uncommon to have servers on remote > > > > > > locations > > > > > > that are only accessible via ssh) and the machine don't boots > > > > > > properly you can find yourself in trouble. > > > > > > > > > > Then surely you test the upgrade before making it live, using kvm > > > > > -snapshot or similar functionality? > > > > > > > > This is simply not possible in physical live, productions servers on > > > > remote CPDs. > > > > > > In that case you test on your staging server first... > > > > > > Ben. > > > > IF you have an staging server... some clients simply do not pay for it. > > Then they already accepted the risk of extended downtime during an > upgrade.
That doesn't, however, mean that it is acceptable for us to recklessly cause such downtime. It seems to me that there is clearly a large group of users for whom an automagic change in init system is desirable, and won't even be noticed. There is however also a large group of sysadmins for whom a noninteractive change of init system is a major, annoying issue. If our priority really is our users, then we can't brush this under the carpet with "you should have read the release notes" - and certainly not when the problem has been foreseen. That is simply not how you respond to someone you actually care about. Debian has a good and hard-earned reputation for not messing up sysadmins' changes; upgrading to systemd - however wonderful it is (and I confess to having no opinion on that) - without at least a debconf prompt of a reasonable priority telling them what is about to happen and offering a bailout, is guaranteed to lose us reputation and users. It doesn't matter whether we think that's reasonable or not, it is what will happen. So, is it actually feasible to provide such a prompt? Cheers, Nick -- Nick Phillips / nick.phill...@otago.ac.nz / 03 479 4195 # These statements are mine, not those of the University of Otago
