On Tue, 2007-01-02 at 18:51 -0800, David Doshay wrote: > SlugGo has played in the Cotsen Open the last 2 years in Los Angeles. > The program has entered in the 10k bracket against humans. People > are allowed to decline being paired against the program because in > AGA rules, games against computers do not count towards your > official ranking. The games are official in the tournament. The first > year the entered programs were SlugGo and Ander's SmartGo, and > because we had met the day before the tournament and the programs > had played 2 games, we requested that the programs not be paired > against each other. > > The first year only one person declined to be paired, only because he > lived in a remote place and got very few official games. The second > year several people expressed a desire not to be paired against SlugGo, > and I think it was partly because SlugGo beat an 8k the first year.
And if Go players are like Chess players, a tiny monetary reward would probably have sufficed to cause most to want to play. In my case there was no reward for playing, only for winning - which perhaps makes it more enticing! Part of the reason I quite playing in human chess tournaments was the Las Vegas atmosphere. I always came to play chess, but the tournaments promised big prize money (or nobody would come) and during the whole debacle people gathered around the pairing boards with their calculators to see how much money they might win if things just happen to fall their way. There were always a few "sand-baggers", to the point that most of us even knew who they were but couldn't prove it. They would play in local rated games and get their ratings down as low as possible, then come to big money tournaments to try to win class prizes. We caught several of them because we recognized them and they had different names than before. What was odd, is that the class prize money was not so high that it was worth the effort. An honest job had a much higher monetary expectancy. You would have to work your butt off for a long weekend just for a chance to win prize money. These guys usually didn't win because it's hard to win a class prize even if you are better on average than your opposition and there were a lot of players competing. Not to mention that they might be competing with other sand-baggers. I never quite understood the whole thing and what motivated these people. But it worked to my advantage when I discovered all I had to do was offer them 5 dollars and suddenly they came alive. The craziest thing of all was when one guy screamed bloody murder about having to play the computer - he had not signed the no-computer list. His face turned red, he literally caused an ugly scene and it was embarrassing. He was screaming and shouting loudly and caused quite a scene. I was embarrassed for him wondering what kind of parents must have raised such a misfit. For some reason, he didn't realize that I had offered the money - in the heat of the moment I didn't remind his of this because he was so adamant about not playing the computer. I didn't want him sitting across from me and I wasn't trying to convince him to play. He found out later I was offering money and came back screaming again even louder, but the TD had already changed his pairing. He was now equally angry about NOT getting to play the computer and the TD was disgusted with him - he wanted it changed back. I had never before directly observed such awful behavior from a 30 year old man. This was back in the days when a 2300 USCF master like he was had a reasonable expectation of beating the computer, so it was all about the money, not any higher principles. He claimed higher principles initially, "I didn't come here to play computers, I came here to play humans." I also wondered how such an irrational unreasonable person could be such a strong player, but this is actually pretty common among really strong chess players, who tend to be mentally unstable for some reason I cannot fathom. - Don > It was looking like SlugGo was not going to be paired in the last round, > so I told the tournament director that he should tell people that SlugGo > had hit a bug that had caused it to crash in all previous games, and > eventually he found someone willing to get the probable win. > > The Cotsen Open has a cash prize for the best computer program, > which I felt somewhat guilty accepting after loosing all games due > to the bug, but SlugGo was the only program entered this year, and > the cash did help to offset the cost of renting the wheelchair van > with hydraulic ramp that I needed to transport the cluster. > > Cheers, > David > > > > On 1, Jan 2007, at 10:02 AM, Don Dailey wrote: > > > Hi Chrilly, > > > > I find it pretty amazing that even a little money will inspire people > > to play a computer who wouldn't otherwise. > > > > Many years ago my old chess programs were welcome at tournaments, but > > as soon as players started losing, the program wore out it's welcome! > > > > The change was like night and day. We came to one tournament and > > almost everyone signed the "refuse to play a computer list." > > > > So I offered 5 dollars for a draw and 10 dollars for a win. This tiny > > incentive caused almost all the players to agree to play the computer > > and in fact many players begged to play it. > > > > What was ironic, was that didn't pay out a single penny but > > everyone was > > happy! > > > > - Don > > > > > > > > On Mon, 2007-01-01 at 18:53 +0100, Chrilly wrote: > >>> > >>>> For Suzie I try for 9x9 to establish a Dan-ranking at the next > >>>> European > >>>> Championship in Villach/Austria. > >>> > >>> Do you mean that you are planning to enter it for a regular > >>> "human" Go > >>> event? Have you checked that the organisers will allow this? > >>> > >>> I once entered Professor Chen's HandTalk for a human Go > >>> tournament which I > >>> was organising, in Oxford. I received no complaints from its > >>> opponents, > >>> but several from stronger players, and from British Go Association > >>> officials, who asked me never to do this again. > >>> > >>> Nick > >> > >> I am in touch with the organizers. They have asked me to give a > >> lecture > >> about computer-go. Maybe one can organize around this a 9x9 match > >> humans > >> against Suzie. Some sort of practical lecture. One has to give the > >> humans > >> some (small) incentive to take the match serious. E.g. at the > >> Vienna chess > >> open I played once with Nimzo Blitz. Every player had to pay 1$. > >> The money > >> was put in a pot and the first winner of a game got the pot. This was > >> extremly popular and some players even went away during their > >> games to hit > >> the jack-pot. > >> > >> I do not plan to play in the official part of the tournament. > >> There is up > >> to my knowledge anyway no 9x9 tournament and if it is, an EC is > >> for humans > >> and not for computers. > >> > >> Chrilly > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> computer-go mailing list > >> computer-go@computer-go.org > >> http://www.computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > computer-go mailing list > > computer-go@computer-go.org > > http://www.computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go/ > _______________________________________________ computer-go mailing list computer-go@computer-go.org http://www.computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go/
