Our experience with Middle "C" has been been similar to Don and others. She loves 12 to 15kts and we only reef in winds over 20kts. We have wheel steering and a stiff hand is needed on the helm at the top of this range, but nothing overwhelming. We have a 155% genoa, a slight rake at the mast and a split backstay. Cranking on the tension on the backstay in heavier, air definitely helps.
Bryan Buttigieg Middle "C" C&C 30 Mk 1 Hull #5 > Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2013 22:28:00 -0500 > From: Curtis <cpt.b...@gmail.com> > > > I do Ron, When sailing alone and the wind is picking up.A bit trying to > reef with stronger winds. > But then this is only my second season on the water. > > >> On Wed, Dec 4, 2013 at 9:22 PM, Don Wagner <don.wag...@verizon.net> wrote: >> >> I owned a C&C 30 mk 1 for about 13 years, and raced her from about 1973 >> to 1986. I also found that it was a very stiff boat and rarely had to reef >> and only occasionally had to fly a # 2 headsail. >> In those days, we all raced with a 170% genoard, since the boats were >> designed for the CCA rule, and PHRF had not yet dictated 155 % for the >> norm. Later I downsized to the 155%, and got the appropriate rating >> improvement. >> Two things that have not been mentioned, that will affect the weather helm >> are: >> If your 30 MK 1 has a wheel instead of a tiller, it will have more >> weather helm, due to the extra weight in the stern. >> The rig was very stiff, but I managed to put some pre-bend in the rig, >> by: moving the mast step aft (inside the cabin) , and shiming the mast >> forward at the deck partners,and cranking on the backstay. The net effect >> was to bend the mast a little bit, and move the center of effort forward. >> >> Typically the helm was well balanced over a wide range of wind speeds. >> >> Just some thoughts from and old 30 MK 1 owner. >> >> Don Wagner >> Red Baron >> C&C 30 MK1 >> 1973 hull # 100 >> >> Now owner of: >> Der Baron >> C&C 41 CB >> 1986 hull # 93 >> >> >> >> >> *From:* Ronald B. Frerker <rbfrer...@yahoo.com> >> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 04, 2013 8:19 PM >> *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com >> *Subject:* Re: Stus-List 30 MKI weather helm >> >> I seem to be in the slot Curtis describes. I've never reefed under 20kt. >> Ron >> Wild Cheri >> >> >> >> On Wednesday, November 27, 2013 8:09 AM, Curtis <cpt.b...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> yea i'm with Ddwight on this one, >> My C&C30 mk1 # 675 loves 11 thru17 knots. >> I dont start thinking of a reef till i'm over 17 knots. I usley drop >> down to the working 115% first. If needed I will put the 1st Reef in >> around 18-22 knots. >> I have hade some uncontroled steering falling off the wind when >> tacking. that was my fault. not the boat. >> >> 1981 C&C 30 MK1 #675 >> >> Beaufort, Sc. >> >> >> >>> On 11/26/13, dwight <dwight...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> I don't think you should have to reef that soon.what is the rake on your >>> mast >>> >>> >>> >>> _____ >>> >>> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Aaron >>> Rouhi >>> Sent: November 26, 2013 7:31 PM >>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com >>> Subject: Re: Stus-List 30 MKI weather helm >>> >>> >>> >>> MK1 is stiff for sure but I just wish I had less weather helm. I >> generally >>> reef in anything above 10 knots... >>> >>> >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >>> Aaron R. >>> >>> Admiral Maggie, >>> >>> 1979 C&C 30 MK1 #540 >>> >>> Annapolis, MD >>> >>> >>> >>> _____ >>> >>> Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2013 18:46:07 -0400 >>> From: dwight...@gmail.com >>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com >>> Subject: Re: Stus-List 30 MKI weather helm >>> >>> The 30 MKI is just a much stiffer boat than the 30 MKII; see here: >>> http://www.cncphotoalbum.com/technical/stability.htm >>> >>> I believe that makes a huge difference in how these 2 very different C&C >> 30 >>> designs perform going to weather, I believe this definitely has an effect >>> on >>> heel angle and propensity to round up...I would expect the 30 MKII to >>> outperform the 30 MKI in light air but in heavier air I would expect the >>> MKI >>> to outperform the MKII, even given that in most areas the MKII has a >> higher >>> rated speed potential and I believ that is due to the relative >> stiffnesses >>> of the boats...here on St. Margaret's Bay where we have mostly fresher >>> afternoon breezes the MKI rules >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Dwight Veinot >>> >>> Alianna >>> C&C 35 MKII >>> >>> Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS >>> >>> >>> >>>> On Tue, Nov 26, 2013 at 5:11 PM, Bill Coleman <colt...@verizon.net> >>> wrote: >>> >>> Around the late 70's and early eighties the 20's and 39's were all >> getting >>> new, deeper rudders. The swept back keels didn't / don't help. >>> >>> >>> >>> Bill Coleman >>> >>> C&C 39 animated_favicon1 >>> >>> >>> >>> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of >> dwight >>> veinot >>> Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2013 2:48 PM >>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com >>> Subject: Re: Stus-List 30 MKI weather helm >>> >>> >>> >>> I don't think it will ever sail as good as the MKI but there are other >>> advantages >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Dwight Veinot >>> >>> Alianna >>> C&C 35 MKII >>> >>> Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS >>> >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Nov 22, 2013 at 2:29 AM, Robert Gallagher <trys...@gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>> My 30MKI had the mast raked back and the rigging on the tight side. >> Weather >>> helm yes, it could be a bear. Round ups never. I could bury the rail >> deep >>> and just keep plowing along. >>> My 30MKII's rudder will stall then round up out of control with to much >>> sail >>> up and not enough tension on the backstay. Too much heel and it gets >>> scary. >>> >>> All that being said im still learning on my MKII > > > > Thanks for the heads up. If they are in Good condition as they appear in the > photo I would be interested if the Drum diameter at the bottom measures > 4-5/8" and the overall height is 3-3/4" . I only need one and am trying to > match what I presently have on the port cabin top. I find that the Barient > #10 came in many different sizes not counting the 10P which is the smallest > of the bunch. > > > > Thanks in advance for your efforts in my behalf. > > > > John > > > > From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Paul > Baker > Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 10:28 PM > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Subject: [SPAM]Re: Stus-List Barient# 10 winch > > > > Hi John, > I saw these on our local listings, > http://www.usedvictoria.com/classified-ad/barient-10-winch-pair_21171681 , > I'm going to see the guy on Friday for some other parts, want me to take a > look at these for you? For $80 it might be worth a punt although I have no > idea how much it would cost to ship them to you. > Cheers, > Paul. > > > > > On Dec 2, 2013, at 7:19 PM, John Russo <johnrussob...@optonline.net> wrote: > > Paul, > > > > Thanks for the response. The16 is a bit too big for the job and the space > available but I will keep it in mind for any future applications. I will > soon have a couple of Barient 22's on my hands that I am replacing with > Lewmar ST 40 EVO winches. > > > > John > > > > From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Paul > Baker > Sent: Saturday, November 30, 2013 10:57 PM > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Subject: Re: Stus-List Barient# 10 winch > > > > I have a pair of stainless Barient 16 I want to sell, bigger is always > better :) > > > On 13-11-30 05:31 PM, John Russo wrote: > > I am looking for a vintage 1984 or later Barient #10 winch to match the > mainsheet winch on my 1984 C&C 32 located on my cabin top port side. I > intend to use the 2nd winch on the starboard cabin top aft of the traveler. > I had a 2nd or 3rd hand Barient #10P there which did not do the job. It is > for multipurpose use to be positioned aft of a Lewmar triple clutch for my > main halyard , outhaul, and Vang. > > > > The #10 that I have on the Port cabin top measures 4&3/8 at the base and is > 3&3/4 tall. It is greyish-Maroon in color and I assume Aluminum as the 1984 > -32 spec calls that out. I have checked out Ebay and there are some #10's > listed but none with the above dimensions or AL. > > > > Any suggestions as to where I can find one? > > > > Thanks > > > > John > > Arpeggio > > Norwalk CT > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album > http://www.cncphotoalbum.com > CnC-List@cnc-list.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album > http://www.cncphotoalbum.com > CnC-List@cnc-list.com > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album > http://www.cncphotoalbum.com > CnC-List@cnc-list.com > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20131204/184e8775/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2013 22:43:24 -0500 > From: John Russo <johnrussob...@optonline.net> > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Subject: Re: Stus-List Barient# 10 winch > Message-ID: <006301cef16c$26604b50$7320e1f0$@optonline.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Brent the 22?s are two speed and now I will probably not get them off the > boat until spring and am sort of contemplating their use for the spinnaker. > Won?t know for a bit . Does your good #10 measure 4-3/8? Diameter at the > Drum base and 3-3/4 ? high? A quick peek under the base should tell you the > material or I could look up the weight to try to determine it. > > John > > > > From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Brent > Driedger > Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 9:57 PM > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Subject: Re: Stus-List Barient# 10 winch > > > > John, the Barient 22s have got my attention. My mkV came with 18s and I find > them slightly under powered when I'm in the "should be putting up the 100" > zone. I happen to have a couple of Barient 10s sitting around that I was > going to add to the cabin top arrangement. One unfortunately has a crack in > the uppermost portion but the other is perfect. They are 1984 black ones of > whatever Dwarfian material they are made of. Let me know what you want for > the 22s. > > Are they 2 speed? > > > > Brent Driedger > > C&C 27-V > > Frozen Lake Winnipeg. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Dec 2, 2013, at 7:19 PM, John Russo <johnrussob...@optonline.net> wrote: > > Paul, > > > > Thanks for the response. The16 is a bit too big for the job and the space > available but I will keep it in mind for any future applications. I will soon > have a couple of Barient 22?s on my hands that I am replacing with Lewmar ST > 40 EVO winches. > > > > John > > > > From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Paul Baker > Sent: Saturday, November 30, 2013 10:57 PM > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Subject: Re: Stus-List Barient# 10 winch > > > > I have a pair of stainless Barient 16 I want to sell, bigger is always better > :) > > > On 13-11-30 05:31 PM, John Russo wrote: > > I am looking for a vintage 1984 or later Barient #10 winch to match the > mainsheet winch on my 1984 C&C 32 located on my cabin top port side. I intend > to use the 2nd winch on the starboard cabin top aft of the traveler. I had a > 2nd or 3rd hand Barient #10P there which did not do the job. It is for > multipurpose use to be positioned aft of a Lewmar triple clutch for my main > halyard , outhaul, and Vang. > > > > The #10 that I have on the Port cabin top measures 4&3/8 at the base and is > 3&3/4 tall. It is greyish-Maroon in color and I assume Aluminum as the 1984 > -32 spec calls that out. I have checked out Ebay and there are some #10?s > listed but none with the above dimensions or AL. > > > > Any suggestions as to where I can find one? > > > > Thanks > > > > John > > Arpeggio > > Norwalk CT > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album > http://www.cncphotoalbum.com > CnC-List@cnc-list.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album > http://www.cncphotoalbum.com > CnC-List@cnc-list.com > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20131204/675b1a2f/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2013 21:51:05 -0600 > From: Brent Driedger <bren...@highspeedcrow.ca> > To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > Subject: Re: Stus-List Barient# 10 winch > Message-ID: <a84ce772-f8e6-4718-8857-b47a649f1...@highspeedcrow.ca> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Hi John. That's exactly the dimensions. It's a 10P. I'll try to send a > picture. The cracked one is in my workshop but the good one is tucked away on > my boat for the winter. It feels like aluminium > > Brent. > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Dec 4, 2013, at 9:43 PM, John Russo <johnrussob...@optonline.net> wrote: >> >> Brent the 22?s are two speed and now I will probably not get them off the >> boat until spring and am sort of contemplating their use for the spinnaker. >> Won?t know for a bit . Does your good #10 measure 4-3/8? Diameter at the >> Drum base and 3-3/4 ? high? A quick peek under the base should tell you the >> material or I could look up the weight to try to determine it. >> John >> >> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Brent >> Driedger >> Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 9:57 PM >> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com >> Subject: Re: Stus-List Barient# 10 winch >> >> John, the Barient 22s have got my attention. My mkV came with 18s and I find >> them slightly under powered when I'm in the "should be putting up the 100" >> zone. I happen to have a couple of Barient 10s sitting around that I was >> going to add to the cabin top arrangement. One unfortunately has a crack in >> the uppermost portion but the other is perfect. They are 1984 black ones of >> whatever Dwarfian material they are made of. Let me know what you want for >> the 22s. >> Are they 2 speed? >> >> Brent Driedger >> C&C 27-V >> Frozen Lake Winnipeg. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Dec 2, 2013, at 7:19 PM, John Russo <johnrussob...@optonline.net> wrote: >> >> Paul, >> >> Thanks for the response. The16 is a bit too big for the job and the space >> available but I will keep it in mind for any future applications. I will >> soon have a couple of Barient 22?s on my hands that I am replacing with >> Lewmar ST 40 EVO winches. >> >> John >> >> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Paul Baker >> Sent: Saturday, November 30, 2013 10:57 PM >> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com >> Subject: Re: Stus-List Barient# 10 winch >> >> I have a pair of stainless Barient 16 I want to sell, bigger is always >> better :) >> >> >> On 13-11-30 05:31 PM, John Russo wrote: >> I am looking for a vintage 1984 or later Barient #10 winch to match the >> mainsheet winch on my 1984 C&C 32 located on my cabin top port side. I >> intend to use the 2nd winch on the starboard cabin top aft of the traveler. >> I had a 2nd or 3rd hand Barient #10P there which did not do the job. It is >> for multipurpose use to be positioned aft of a Lewmar triple clutch for my >> main halyard , outhaul, and Vang. >> >> The #10 that I have on the Port cabin top measures 4&3/8 at the base and is >> 3&3/4 tall. It is greyish-Maroon in color and I assume Aluminum as the 1984 >> -32 spec calls that out. I have checked out Ebay and there are some #10?s >> listed but none with the above dimensions or AL. >> >> Any suggestions as to where I can find one? >> >> Thanks >> >> John >> Arpeggio >> Norwalk CT >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album >> http://www.cncphotoalbum.com >> CnC-List@cnc-list.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album >> http://www.cncphotoalbum.com >> CnC-List@cnc-list.com >> _______________________________________________ >> This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album >> http://www.cncphotoalbum.com >> CnC-List@cnc-list.com > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20131204/db2e8ec5/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2013 22:57:29 -0500 > From: John Russo <johnrussob...@optonline.net> > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Subject: Re: Stus-List Barient# 10 winch > Message-ID: <008b01cef16e$1e380f10$5aa82d30$@optonline.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Interesting ? My 10 P measures 4? Dia and 3-1/2 in high. Weird! > > > > From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Brent > Driedger > Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2013 10:51 PM > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Subject: Re: Stus-List Barient# 10 winch > > > > Hi John. That's exactly the dimensions. It's a 10P. I'll try to send a > picture. The cracked one is in my workshop but the good one is tucked away on > my boat for the winter. It feels like aluminium > > > > Brent. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Dec 4, 2013, at 9:43 PM, John Russo <johnrussob...@optonline.net> wrote: > > Brent the 22?s are two speed and now I will probably not get them off the > boat until spring and am sort of contemplating their use for the spinnaker. > Won?t know for a bit . Does your good #10 measure 4-3/8? Diameter at the > Drum base and 3-3/4 ? high? A quick peek under the base should tell you the > material or I could look up the weight to try to determine it. > > John > > > > From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Brent > Driedger > Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2013 9:57 PM > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Subject: Re: Stus-List Barient# 10 winch > > > > John, the Barient 22s have got my attention. My mkV came with 18s and I find > them slightly under powered when I'm in the "should be putting up the 100" > zone. I happen to have a couple of Barient 10s sitting around that I was > going to add to the cabin top arrangement. One unfortunately has a crack in > the uppermost portion but the other is perfect. They are 1984 black ones of > whatever Dwarfian material they are made of. Let me know what you want for > the 22s. > > Are they 2 speed? > > > > Brent Driedger > > C&C 27-V > > Frozen Lake Winnipeg. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Dec 2, 2013, at 7:19 PM, John Russo <johnrussob...@optonline.net> wrote: > > Paul, > > > > Thanks for the response. The16 is a bit too big for the job and the space > available but I will keep it in mind for any future applications. I will soon > have a couple of Barient 22?s on my hands that I am replacing with Lewmar ST > 40 EVO winches. > > > > John > > > > From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Paul Baker > Sent: Saturday, November 30, 2013 10:57 PM > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Subject: Re: Stus-List Barient# 10 winch > > > > I have a pair of stainless Barient 16 I want to sell, bigger is always better > :) > > > On 13-11-30 05:31 PM, John Russo wrote: > > I am looking for a vintage 1984 or later Barient #10 winch to match the > mainsheet winch on my 1984 C&C 32 located on my cabin top port side. I intend > to use the 2nd winch on the starboard cabin top aft of the traveler. I had a > 2nd or 3rd hand Barient #10P there which did not do the job. It is for > multipurpose use to be positioned aft of a Lewmar triple clutch for my main > halyard , outhaul, and Vang. > > > > The #10 that I have on the Port cabin top measures 4&3/8 at the base and is > 3&3/4 tall. It is greyish-Maroon in color and I assume Aluminum as the 1984 > -32 spec calls that out. I have checked out Ebay and there are some #10?s > listed but none with the above dimensions or AL. > > > > Any suggestions as to where I can find one? > > > > Thanks > > > > John > > Arpeggio > > Norwalk CT > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album > http://www.cncphotoalbum.com > CnC-List@cnc-list.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album > http://www.cncphotoalbum.com > CnC-List@cnc-list.com > > _______________________________________________ > This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album > http://www.cncphotoalbum.com > CnC-List@cnc-list.com > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20131204/7ab82c78/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2013 20:44:47 -0800 > From: Russ & Melody <russ...@telus.net> > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Subject: Re: Stus-List wire halyards > Message-ID: > <mailman.2092.1386218690.13012.cnc-list_cnc-list....@cnc-list.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" > > Hi Steve, > > In the quest for speed it means constantly trying to improve power to > weight ratio as well as lowering drag, maintaining sail shape, etc. > > AG, a vintage 1981 45 from the custom yard has aluminium chainplates > and chainplate bolts, but here's the best part... the chainplate > bolts are drilled hollow to save weight! This is below-decks weight savings. > > Cheers, Russ > Sweet 35 mk-1 > > > At 12:40 PM 04/12/2013, you wrote: > >> Never knew that they had used aluminum bolts. Certainly something >> to watch out for. I can't imagine wanting aluminum bolts on >> anything that doesn't fly. Bound to cause trouble eventually. >> >> The shroud tang through bolt at the spreaders on my boat is stainless. >> >> Steve Thomas >> 1978 C&C27 MKIII >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com]On Behalf Of David >> Jacobs >> Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2013 3:07 PM >> To: w...@wbryant.com; cnc-list@cnc-list.com >> Subject: Re: Stus-List wire halyards >> >> >> Interestingly, I was talking to people at NE Rigging Systems in Concord, MA >> just yesterday about replacing the rod on my 1983 C&C35 MK III and they told >> me about this issue. Apparently C&C changed from aluminum through bolts >> (through the mast holding the rod connection fittings) in the late 80's to >> SST through bolts because the internal wire halyards would cut through the >> aluminum bolts over time. They just did a C&C 40 and found that the aluminum >> bolts were almost completely cut through. >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album >> http://www.cncphotoalbum.com >> CnC-List@cnc-list.com > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > <http://cnc-list.com/pipermail/cnc-list_cnc-list.com/attachments/20131204/b95021e0/attachment.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > CnC-List mailing list > CnC-List@cnc-list.com > http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com > > > ------------------------------ > > End of CnC-List Digest, Vol 95, Issue 25 > **************************************** _______________________________________________ This List is provided by the C&C Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
