Hi, We had a little discussion about UI stuff in Cin3, some points raised were rather interesting, so I'd like to put a little attention on those. :-)
The first Part of the Mail is a little ranting, so scroll down, if you are not into flamebaits. ;-) Some of the suggestions of different People were into totally opposite directions, like for example: Stefan de Konink <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> says: > If in your perception we are making an 'office like' application that > edits video, I might be wrong. But we probably can stick with what > already exists. I am hoping we will design a GUI that is thought > 'out-of-the-box'. As a toolkit and not some application, something you > will focus on 100% when you use it. Artem Baguinski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> says: > A "Serious" reason to reuse widgets wouldn't be lazyness of > programmers, but satisfaction of users. The less skills user has to > forget each time s?he starts another application - the better. > > What you really want is to make sure the same things are done the same > way, similar things are done similar way, and things that are unique > to your application are kept to minimum. I am with Artem in this case, because I don't think we should try to outsmart everyone else by making something totally crazy and unconventional. I think we are going for a solid, stable and reliable tool, and I don't think that this is the place to get sidetracked by experimenting with to many new ideas. I am open to apply novel and innovative interface concepts in isolated well defined use-cases. But for the overall application and Interface, I strongly vote for and suggest to go the way of boring, well proven and familiar concepts. Other than that, and this is just my opinion and observation. I do not think that Stefan de Koninks Comments are moving us forward very much. Stefan, while I value your willingness to discuss, and to contribute your thoughts and Ideas, I also hope that I can point out some flaws in your arguments, not to offend you, but to encourage you to make even better suggestions. :-) This is going to be a serious App, and somehow compromises are necessary. I am not saying that there is no room for freewheeling and unconventional ideas, but lets assume that we do have some limitations both in the resources that we have and in the problems that we want to solve. Try to think inside that box. ;-) Stefan de Konink <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> says: > I'm sorry developer time is more expensive? Where do you come from? We > are not starting a NewCinelerra company and probably want to have the > best (not the optimal) solution for the system. Yes, developer time is actually expensive, why? Because we only have very little of it. I guess most of us are hobbiests, working in our free time. So better use that time efficiently, and not waste it. Sure we do not have any deadlines, we can take as much time as we wont to, but if it takes 10 years to write a better cinelerra, then I don't think this is going to make anyone here happy. Think about it, if we can come to a resonable implementation in 1 Year, we have 9 more years to play around with crazy innovative concepts. ;-) The Point is, that we will use an existing well proven toolkit, because it will save us Time and Headache. There is no serious alternative. BUT: This does not mean that there is no room for fancy stuff. We just have to deal with it that all the basics are standard of the shelf Widgets, Like: Buttons, TreeViews, TextEdit Fields, File Open Selectors, and so on.... While it might look like trivial stuff, creating all those basic things will take time, and if you want to do it right, it will take a long time! So better don't do it ourselves. So I repeat myself: GTK as well is Qt are well up to the task provide a Widgetset for a Video Editor. Period. So don't even think about recommending your personal favorite niche Toolkit. =========================================================== =========================================================== So after all that Ranting, I'll move on to less Fluff, more Stuff. ;-) Ichthyostega <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> says: > When working with the current "state of the art" in any real world > project, I constantly have *too much* tracks, *too much* effect > windows open, *too much* sliders, *too much* knobs, I need to scroll > around all the time, poke through endless tabs/lists/bins, while > actually working at any time with only a limited focus set of > entities. The problem being, this focus is not constant, it doesn't > fit with the systematic hierarchy and is not known in advance. > We should try to improve things here! This of course is a problem that is very disconnected from the "Core" Video Editing Problem, and therefore an ideal candidate to develop individually. But it is also a very difficult Problem, because it is what I like to call a "Workflow" Problem. The Problem varies widely between people, because everyone has a different Workflow, some people might shoot lots of footage for a particular project and want to organize that information, others already have a large pool of stuff that they tend to reuse again and again in a remixing fashion, others might have lots of takes of the same scene and want to single out the best shot, etc.... There are plenty of use cases that I can think of here, and all of them are different. This is also a problem that is not so technical but much more about Perception, and Information Categorization and Organisation. Implementation will probably not too difficult, so whoever wants to take up on that task should be willing to do lots of Screen Mockups and Detailed Workflow Examples and Explainations. ;-) I suggest to look at the following applications to get some inspirations about footage organization: http://picasa.google.com/ http://macslow.thepimp.net/?p=125 http://f-spot.org/ If you have more links, please add them. If you are interested to work on that problem, send in your proposals. :-) Cheers, and have fun, -Richard _______________________________________________ Cinelerra mailing list [email protected] https://init.linpro.no/mailman/skolelinux.no/listinfo/cinelerra
