Gautam Mukunda wrote: > --- Robert Seeberger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: >> I figure we are several years past the point where >> you began to >> believe such things about me. But I deny that you >> are an iota more >> patriotic than any other person on this list. >> >> xponent > > Well so do I, so this is exactly what I mean. I've > never done that. I have said that I'm far less likely > to claim that people disagree with me because they are > stupid or evil, but that's not patriotism. Decency, > perhaps. You've immediately proven my point.
What I am reacting to is this: "As for the opposite side...I am on the side of the United States of America. If you choose to be on the opposite side from me, that's your choice. I can say that at least I'm on the side that tolerates disagreement, is able to talk with people without insulting them, and is interested in rational argument. So I'm pretty comfortable with that side. If you want to join us, it's always open." The first two sentences above really set me off. And I can only hope that you can understand why. I've heard those words before, usually in conjunction with some rhetoric regarding the proper place for niggers and spics or how America is so perfect that no criticism need be spoken unless one wants to mark oneself as unpatriotic. I don't hear quite so much of this these days, but having been exposed to such for most of my life and having been aware of how nasty such attitudes are for at least 35 years, hearing the echo is enough to raise my hackles and set me to a fighting mood. I want everyone to know that *that* is unfair to Gautam. But I think too that there has been a whole hell of a lot of this circulating onlist lately and I ascribe it to some willfull misunderstanding of the words of others.........me included. When a /suggestion/ becomes an /accusation/, someone is grinding an axe. > It's > mommy, mommy again. Well, that's pretty pathetic, but > it's nothing more than A-Rod trying to persuade the > refs he didn't purposely knock the ball out of > Arroyo's hand. It's not true, you know it's not true, > and _I_ know it's not true. It's just a convenient > argument you can use to try to stop anyone from > disagreeing with you. After all, if the people you > disagree with are _evil_, then there's no tactic > that's not allowed. So why not make claims that are > absurd on their face. You might just get away with > them, and besides, you're the good guys, right? > > I'm done here. Nice rant! But I also do not appreciate words I never said being attributed to me. I wouldn't normally describe Bushco as evil. I think that many of *Them* are liars. In some cases outright, in others that they withold the truth (in an attempt to decieve) or intentionally mislead. I think Bush himself would likely spent some time in prison if his Dad had not been VP and then President. Some of his crew are people I just dislike because of their politics. (Neocons) But what does it matter to you what I think about such things? Does that prevent us from being friends? I'd like to think not. I'd like to think that we could vehemently disagree about certain political realities and other political beliefs, and then have a good time drinking some brews and watching the Sox whup up on the Cards with any acrimony set aside for the next political round or even disposed of altogether. ********************************************************************** I absolutely think that it is a human and a spiritual triumph that people with radically different outlooks and dispositions look to each other and say "We are Americans" [Terrans] [Humans] [Minds] and mean it. It is a triumph because it is so very very f*cking hard to do, every day, and mean it, and live it. We often fall down. I do. And I'm sorry when I do. But I believe. And I stand again. And I'll stand with you when you will have me. And I'll stand and wait when you won't. But I don't want to divide the house. We are all so very different, but have so much in common. Seeing that is the difficulty. ********************************************************************** xponent I Stand Maru rob _______________________________________________ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
