On 6/22/20 5:18 PM, nch via agora-discussion wrote: > On 6/22/20 3:55 PM, James Cook via agora-discussion wrote: >> On Mon, 22 Jun 2020 at 20:53, Publius Scribonius Scholasticus via >> agora-discussion <agora-discussion@agoranomic.org> wrote: >>> On 6/22/20 4:06 PM, nch via agora-discussion wrote: >>>> On 6/22/20 3:00 PM, Publius Scribonius Scholasticus via agora-discussion >>>> wrote: >>>>> On 6/22/20 3:50 PM, James Cook via agora-discussion wrote: >>>>>> I can do that without objection >>>>> I can save everyone time by saying that I will object. >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> ---- >>>>> Publius Scribonius Scholasticus, Herald, Referee, Tailor, Pirate >>>>> Champion, Badge of the Great Agoran Revival, Badge of the Salted Earth >>>> Can I ask what detriment you feel there is to having an extra optional >>>> discussion forum? We already have the irc and it doesn't seem to impede >>>> normal play... >>>> >>> For me, I am concerned that it could normalize the use of a proprietary, >>> locked-in platform as an official place of discussion. >> My concern exactly. >> >> - Falsifian > > Trust me, I have spent my entire life using linux and working for non > profits, I don't like proprietary. I understand the wariness against > Embrace, Extend, Extinguish [1] strategies. But the concern about > lock-in for this seems overblown. We had the extremely ephemeral irc. > Nobody backed up the conversations there to some archive, and nobody > cares because it was specifically meant for conversations that aren't > meant to last.
That's an objection I have as well, and I've investigated good archiving options, but they don't really exist and I have questions about the ethics of it, but that ship has sailed. > > This is meant to give us back that ephemeral chat. And it already has, > frankly. In the discord right now is 9 established players, 1 observer, > and 1 new player. We've done a lot of collaboration on the github pages. > Nothing these permanent archives would miss, I promise. Things like > asking each other git technical questions and rapid feedback. Also, > we've told jokes and talked about side topics and generally goofed > around in an incredibly refreshing way that has no place on a mailing list. > > And every time anyone in the server wanted to say something longer > winded, they've sent it to the mailing lists. Because that's what > mailing lists are good at. Having two tools with two different strengths > makes us stronger than using one tool to do everything. > > Again, I shy away from proprietary. But it shouldn't be binary, it > should be a continuum. Discord fills a slot nothing us is filling for us > right now. It has a (in my personal opinion) good TOS and good revenue > plan, ones which are mostly kind to the user. If we find something that > performs a similar roll to it in the future but is open source, I'm all > for killing it for that. This makes sense, but I think the solution to this is to try to establish some sort of bridge or create some way for people to access it without an account. > > I don't think we should turn away a good enough tool because it's not > perfect. That slowly kills us and alienates us. The fact that I've seen > 3 people show up and then disappear in the last few weeks, two of which > explicitly complaining about the avalanche of emails and uncertainty > about where they can ask questions, should be proof of that. If you're correct about the usage of this, only one of those problems will be solved. I think we should think about ways to better deal with the avalanche on top of this solution. -- ---- Publius Scribonius Scholasticus, Herald, Referee, Tailor, Pirate Champion, Badge of the Great Agoran Revival, Badge of the Salted Earth
