come on ken, cambium would never sell anything that wasnt field tested On Fri, Mar 6, 2020 at 1:13 PM Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com> wrote:
> I guess from the approach of not being afraid to ask stupid questions, is > it possible you are the first customer to ever use the Dragonwave adapter? > Is it possible Cambium (or Ceragon if they are the source for the adapter) > designed and made it but has never actually tested it? And there’s some > fatal flaw in the design? > > > > This seems unlikely, but when none of the likely explanations pan out, you > have to look elsewhere. > > > > > > *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones > *Sent:* Friday, March 6, 2020 12:54 PM > *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com> > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] PTP Microwave antenna question > > > > whats the OMT look like? That V/H pin puts the plate at 45? > > > > On Fri, Mar 6, 2020 at 12:48 PM Caleb Knauer <cknauer.li...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > If that center part is press fit in slightly catawampus and not 100% > plumb then it could cause issues. Or the pipe isn't 100% either. But > kind of grasping at straws with that. > > On the C's I've bench tested with XPIC without antennas, it'll talk to > either one IIRC if you run 2/1 or 1/2 as I've played with it. It's > really not happy about it though. I'd have to confirm though, been a > bit. > > XPIC keys or settings wouldn't affect the raw RXL levels, it just > blows out your MSE if they're crossed. I've seen links where they > didn't turn on anything XPIC but set it up and it works, just kinda > janky. > > You could always mute one core on both sides and sanity check that way > too. If something is crossed, it'd show the right RXL one on core and > 30ish dBm down on the other core. > > On Fri, Mar 6, 2020 at 1:12 PM Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com> wrote: > > > > You look at Mark's photo and think what could possibly be wrong, it's a > round hole. How many ways are there to install a round hole, it's like the > proverbial one car funeral procession. > > > > And I guess with an 820C + OMT, having H and V swapped shouldn't be > possible, and even if they were, it would still work if you did the same > thing at both ends. I wouldn't assume though that XPIC would straighten > out an H/V swap, I don't think it's like MIMO on WiFi. XPIC assumes the > antenna cross pol rejection does most of the work and it has to clean up > what remains. > > > > I'm assuming you have the XPIC keys enabled, although that would > probably create an alarm not the symptoms you are seeing. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> On Behalf Of Caleb Knauer > > Sent: Friday, March 6, 2020 11:40 AM > > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com> > > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PTP Microwave antenna question > > > > With XPIC it wouldn't matter that slot 1 was talking to slot 2 on the > other side, it wouldn't know. At least I think anyways. Since it's just > looking for RX on the frequency it's set, and it's on the same on both > ends, and it'd still have XPD to separate the two. You could rotate one > end 90 degrees to simulate on the office rig to test I suppose. Plus > anyways if you can't get signal worth a flip on the office rig, even if it > was a polarity thing, that short of a link should blast it through to > something you'd see. > > > > Only thing I can think of is that something in that tube is not aligned, > bad press fit or mill or something like that and the waves are getting > blown out of phase or similar. There's not but one way to put it together, > and 820c -> OMT takes it to circular and you have circular to dish. > > > > On Fri, Mar 6, 2020 at 12:30 PM Mark Radabaugh <m...@amplex.net> wrote: > > > > > > Odd thing is I don’t see any way to assemble this any way that would > swap polarity. Only way to screw it up would be internal to the OMT > itself. We are doing XPIC with this link which we have not done in a lot > of other places, so that is different. > > > > > > Mark > > > > > > On Mar 6, 2020, at 12:22 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote: > > > > > > > > > V&H being swapped will always cost you at least 20 dB and if you have > them precisely aligned V&H I can see where 40 dB is reasonable. > > > > > > From: Ken Hohhof > > > Sent: Friday, March 6, 2020 10:18 AM > > > To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' > > > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PTP Microwave antenna question > > > > > > > > > OK, that says the antenna should be dual pol capable. So … is a > puzzlement. You’d expect a problem would cost a few dB, not 40 dB. Unless > H & V were swapped. > > > > > > > > > > > > Sounds like Cambium is looking into it, maybe they come up with some > ideas. > > > > > > > > > > > > From: AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> On Behalf Of Mark Radabaugh > > > Sent: Friday, March 6, 2020 11:00 AM > > > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com> > > > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PTP Microwave antenna question > > > > > > > > > > > > It’s currently 2 single pol Horizons on a Dragonwave OMT mount that > combines the H&V to the round waveguide on the back of the antenna. > > > > > > Mark Radabaugh > > > > > > Amplex > > > > > > 22690 Pemberville Rd > > > > > > Luckey, OH 43443 > > > > > > 419-261-5996 > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mar 6, 2020, at 11:19 AM, Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > We put 11 GHz 820C w/XPIC on existing Trango 3 ft dishes replacing > single pol ApexPlus ODUs and everything went as expected. I’d have to look > up the details but I think it worked because Trango used Remec circular > even with single pol except for 6 GHz. We should have adjusted for best > XPIC cancellation but instead we just made sure the ODUs were plumb. But I > think what we did was roughly the same as what you’re doing, so it should > work. > > > > > > > > > > > > We got a couple bad 820S radios last year, failed the RF loopback > test, but it sounds like you have pretty thoroughly verified it’s not bad > radios. > > > > > > > > > > > > Were the Dragonwaves single or dual pol? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> On Behalf Of Mark Radabaugh > > > Sent: Friday, March 6, 2020 9:37 AM > > > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com> > > > Subject: [AFMUG] PTP Microwave antenna question > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We have installed a lot of Cambium 820C radios without much trouble. > Yes, the configuration takes some getting used to but we probably have 46 > links working and installed, so it’s not like it’s our first rodeo > configuring these things. > > > > > > > > > > > > And then we tried something new - reusing a 4’ Andrew Dragonwave > antenna in a XPIC configuration. We purchased the Cambium adapter plate > that clips onto the antenna radio mount and presents the 820C mount for the > OMT. Take off the dual Horizon radio OMT, add the 820C and the RF signal > is shit - in the -80’s from the mid 40’s. Reverse the process and put the > Horizon’s back on and the signal is fine. > > > > > > > > > > > > So we thought we had a bad 820C. It’s happened before. So we take > two different sets of 820C’s and test them one at a time swapping them in > for known good installed radios on working links. The 820C’s are fine. > > > > > > > > > > > > Okay… we forgot to test the OMT's when we did that. So we try the > OMT’s in the shop - and they work fine. > > > > > > > > > > > > At this point the only thing left is the antennas themselves and the > adapter plate. The adapter plate is nothing more than a hole in a > aluminum bushing with a couple of small steps to match diameter between the > OMT and the antenna waveguide. Pretty hard to screw up. > > > > > > > > > > > > We have a pair of Dragonwave antenna’s in the shop that we can mount > all of this to and try here - and we can’t get a decent signal even 20’ > apart. I’m at a loss at this point. The only part that doesn’t appear > to work is the adapter plate - and there is nothing interesting about it. > > > > > > > > > > > > How the heck can this not work: > > > > > > > > > > > > <image001.jpg> > > > > > > > > > > > > <image002.jpg> > > > > > > > > > > > > I can’t buy that the alignment of the antenna would need to be > adjusted. That makes no sense in my head. Am I wrong in that assumption? > > > > > > > > > > > > Mark > > > > > > -- > > > AF mailing list > > > AF@af.afmug.com > > > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > -- > > > AF mailing list > > > AF@af.afmug.com > > > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > > -- > > > AF mailing list > > > AF@af.afmug.com > > > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > > > > > -- > > > AF mailing list > > > AF@af.afmug.com > > > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > > > -- > > AF mailing list > > AF@af.afmug.com > > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > > > > > > > -- > > AF mailing list > > AF@af.afmug.com > > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >
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